I don’t know if this topic had been made, or if this is a little hard to discuss. If there is a thread like this already, or if it goes against Pixar Planet’s rules, please lock it.
I do have a question about Ellie, regarding when she considered having a child. When she and Carl go to the doctor, Ellie is obviously upset, and it probably had to do with her child. However, the exact reason is unclear. Could it be that Ellie was having a child but it died before it was born, or is she barren (that is, she cannot have children)?
I’m in the camp that believes that [spoil]Ellie had a miscarriage - she really was pregnant, but lost the baby (apparently early on). The Doctor then had to tell her that she probably would never be able to have children. Now, the argument in favor of this explanation has always been that we see Carl and Ellie painting/furnishing a nursery, and normally, people would not set up a nursery until they knew they were expecting a baby. But, if there is one person in the world who would plunge straight into furnishing a nursery the moment she knew she wanted kids, it would be Ellie. So, it’s still possible that she was never pregnant, and was just rushing into, “We’re going to have LOTS of babies, so we’d better get ready now!” But, logically, I think she miscarried.[/spoil]
I’ve always assumed she was barren, because she never looked or acted pregnant, the baby room was very vague, not really boy-ish or girly. Plus, if it was a miscarriage, people as eager as them would have tried again. P.S. I don’t know how to use spoiler tags.
I guess I always assumed that she was barren, but then karly05’s theory does make sense- I hadn’t thought about how they’d been decorating the baby’s room. Ellie doesn’t look particularly pregnant at any point in the montage though, does she? It’s a difficult one to tell, but I guess it’s either that she was being told she was barren, or that she’d had a miscarriage and was then told that she would perhaps always miscarry, or would not be able to concieve again for some reason. I can’t imagine it just being a miscarriage as Carl and Ellie would have tried again.
Oh, and spoiler tags aren’t really necessary as Up has been out on DVD around the world for a while now, but for future reference IncredigirlVirginia, how to use spoiler tags is outlined here- The ‘How to…’ Thread.
I think the fact that Ellie doesn’t look pregnant in the nursery scene is what really leaves the question open.
One note about the “gender-neutral” nursery, though: back when Carl & Ellie were young, expectant parents didn’t know ahead of time whether they were having a boy or a girl. It’s so common nowadays, with sonograms and so forth, we forget it wasn’t always like that.
Ellie had a miscariage. Pretty much for the exact same reasons addressed by karly05. Though Ellie is an eager woman, willing to jump at something the moment she hears about it, I don’t think she and Carl would set up a nursery unless they knew for sure they were going to have a baby. As for not “showing” at the time of nursery construction, pregnant mothers really don’t start to show for weeks after conception. Practically all expecting mothers know they are with child way before the signs of pregnancy start to appear. I also think she had a miscarriage becuase of her devestation in the hospital and afterwards. Though not 100% likely, I feel like Ellie would know if she was infertile before trying to have a child. The doctors would have to know! As well, if I were an expecting mother and I lost my baby mid-pregnancy, I would never be able to get over it. I personally feel the trauma from losing a child is much worse than the trauma from discovering you cannot have a child. That baby was alive inside of you, a part of you, your own creation, and a miscarriage takes that all away. This just seems so much worse, and that is the response I see in Ellie. To address the point made by lizardgirl, I still think a miscarriage occured, but I agree she was told she would never be able to have a child again. Either that or the experience of losing one baby was too much for her to handle to ever try again.
Just my opinion, but I feel strongly about it. I hope it adds to the discussion.
Ellie having a miscariage would make sense. Plus it fits with the story. If they had kids Carl would have a better relationship with them and have a better friendship ship with Russle from th start. Someone on YouTube said that.
love70ways, good post. And yeah, I think it’s common for pregnant women to be a few months along before they’re “showing” (and Ellie would suspect and run to the doctor for confirmation that she was pregnant well before that point).
I know I read/heard somewhere (I’m thinking it was in a print interview with Pete Docter, but I wouldn’t swear to it) that they felt they had to explain why Carl & Ellie never had kids, because if they had, the kids and grandkids would be around to grieve with Carl, and they would have each other, and it was crucial to the story for Carl to feel completely alone without Ellie.
As for me, it seemed pretty clear that she just couldn’t have children. Carl doesn’t seem to be grieving with her, he pats her in such a way like “that’s all right, not your fault, I don’t blame you, we can do other things”. But miscarriages can happen early on in pregnancy. Edit Meaning that Ellie could be pregnant but not visibly so, yet.
If it was a miscarriage, then they would have tried again? But apparently the idea of an active nursery was immediately moot, and it looks like there were no further serious attempts or further miscarriages. So I’m part of the sterility camp.
I always just assumed they lost the baby, mainly for the reasons already stated. It just seemed to fit in with the story and it never crossed my mind to think otherwise. Although those of you who say she’s barren also bring up some good points that I never thought about before. Hmmm.
Exactly! She sees a LOT of babies in the sky. She’s obviously eager to have as many babies as possible. The only reason she wouldn’t try again would be if she was barren.
Besides, I think the greatest proof is the scene of the doctor. He’s explaining something (and the uterus image in the background isn’t casual). They are in his office, not in a hospital bed like they would be if she just had a miscarriage.
And, once they find out they can’t have children, they change that dream for the dream of the adventure, like a substitute.
Hmm, many of these arguments are very persuasive, and I really am torn. I hate to say this, but perhaps this is just a short instance of bad story telling by Pixar. Both points seem so likely, and it really is unclear.
Even Shakespeare’s writtings have major/flaws and discrepancies.
In certain occasions, these apparent flaws aren’t flaws at all. Sometimes it’s on purpose so that each person can make his own interpretation.
Anyway, I’m personally convinced that this is not the case. The storytelling in the Married Life montage is very clear and all the elements point to one conclusion.
Actually, I think it’s good storytelling - The filmmakers made the point they needed to make: Carl and Ellie Can’t Have Children. They don’t really need to tell us why - and, in a way, by not telling us, they’re letting us project our own interpretations and emotions on the situation. The fact that we’re sitting here debating this a year after the movie came out shows that they accomplished the big goal, which was to make us care about Carl & Ellie and their life together.
I will say, I had not thought that hard about Carl’s reaction, and I think DarkHand makes an excellent observation of how that supports the “barren” theory.
While I agree the sequence is very clear, the elements clearly do no point to one conclusion about the pregnancy. Otherwise, there’d be no need for this thread.
lol
