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The CDA: dark or not?

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Is the CDA 'dark'/shady?

Yes
5
63%
No
1
13%
Not sure
2
25%
 
Total votes : 8

The CDA: dark or not?

Postby mentalguru » Fri Jan 01, 2010 3:45 pm

Due to some discussions both in the past and more recently on another forum I just thought I'd bring it here- what is your opinion on the CDA? Do you find them to be more than a little freaky or not?

While probably unintentional perhaps the movie does have hints that the CDA is not really all that great. What with Roz's line of "None of this ever happened gentlemen... and I don't want to see any paperwork on this...". While humorous on some level (that line) because of MIKE, it also shows the idea of them keeping a lot of things under wraps perhaps for their own purposes and intent. Roz doesn't want a papertrail leading to the events which transpired...

While Roz's undercover work is fine for moral body to instigate, there are still some things off with that line completely as well as how the CDA acts.

Nexas as also mentioned about the company play when I said I felt that the play MUST have been displayed as purely fictional for the CDA to allow it (and they did indeed supervise it it seems), Nexas pointed out that the play means Mike gets to blow his steam about it, while STILL keeping the secret which is VERY true, and pretty clever on their part! Mike is just being a blowhard and adding a lot of frills to the story- so no-one would believe it if they knew Mike in anyway! Guy's usually screwy with the truth.

Plus it's just a fact that the CDA is way too rough sometimes in their actions- look at poor George. It would probably be better for them to firmly and calmly state for George to lie down rather than complete jump on him for example. I mean good grief...

I've also had my suspicions raised that certain members of the CDA knew humans weren't toxic- I mean Roz doesn't react with Sulley having Boo in his arms very much- and we don't see him get the 'cone treatment' later on when he takes her back home AT ALL.

Pretty suspicious all in all.

Perhaps in the end certain members know, but the CDA holds power and clout which they don't want to give up on, it's my own personal theory that once humans and monsters were BOTH 'toxic' on some level to one another due to germs (Sulley even mentions it to boo when she's in his bed right?), and monsters and hyumans both died as a result. So once the CDA WERE needed in some capacity for 'disinfection' but over time, with adaption the monsters and humans have been exposed to enough of their coughs and sneezes and diseases (rhyming :D) so that it's no longer a risk anymore in the movie events.

But monsters still believe the 'toxicity' exists, and with the fear comes power. It could even be a thing encouraged so that monsters won't get too curious about humans or the human world and risk exposing the monster world to adult humans.

The CDA seems to get away with a lot, and it's shady at best in a lot of their actions. I'm kind of hoping that if a sequel ever occurs- this is kind of acknowledged and touched upon actually, if they NEED an antagonist set up, I think the CDA would be great for this, as well as perhaps some humans who are getting suspicious...

The CDA is interesting to explore, and we've had some discussion already elsewhere- but what's the opinion HERE on the matter?
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Postby Princess_Darkness » Fri Jan 01, 2010 4:06 pm

I will admit that the CDA is an interesting group especially since it's hard to tell what they are exactly...are they some form of government or just the basic clean up crew? If they remind me of anything, they remind me of the G.U.N. force within the Sonic the hedgehog games...GUN, while a governmental group, was created to keep the citizens safe within that universe handled things that I personally didn't approve of...any Sonic fans who had ever played Sonic Adventure 2 or it's GC counterpart remembers that in the cutscenes, it showed parts of what happened upon Space Colony ARK when GUN was sent up there to shut the place down, even the anime Sonic X touched a little more on it, the soldiers from GUN were given orders to capture Project SHADOW, arrest the one who created him, and take out anyone who stood in their way...this also included anyone who was nothing more but an innocent bystander...it was even a soldier from GUN who due to his orders, shot and killed young Maria Robotnic, a young girl who had nothing to do with the project but was still taken out due to orders...I would have to say that is what the CDA reminds me of actually...I also can't help but wonder exactly how much power does the CDA has after all, as I had seen within the Sonic games, too much power isn't always a good thing...if in a sequel, Pixar were to use the CDA to play the part of the villian, it would be quite easy to pull off in my opinion...
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Postby pitbulllady » Fri Jan 01, 2010 5:58 pm

The CDA IS a government group, not just a clean-up crew. They are analogous to both our FBI(in the US) and our EPA, with hints of the CIA thrown in. They wield a lot of power and instill fear in companies and individuals. It's hard to say just HOW much power, but for someone in Henry J. Waternoose's position to fear them, it must be considerable.

As Mentalguru pointed out, they aren't exactly on the "up and up", either, insofar as being honest. They aren't above a cover-up or two, to protect someone that they know they can manipulate into being an ally. I don't think for one moment that Roz or any of the other CDA members believed that human children actually were toxic, but it certainly worked to their advantage to perpetuate that myth. Fear of something is what puts a lot of governments in control of the people. We're seeing that right now here in the US, where a national animal rights group has garnered the support of a US bureaucracy, the US Dept. of the Interior, to push for a ban on large snakes, nationwide, utilizing and indeed exacerbating the fear so many people have of snakes, a fear which is basically as groundless as the monsters' fear of "toxic" children. They are using that fear to push an agenda and to control people's daily lives, right down to the choice of what kind of pets they can have. In the movie, we see not only cover-ups of the activities at the factory, but control of the media by the CDA. Any time a government agency has that sort of power, it becomes dangerous.

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Postby SgtYayap » Fri Jan 01, 2010 9:15 pm

I was originally going to vote "Not sure"....until I was persuaded by pitbulllady's analogy to the AR movement, which I ALSO am strictly opposed to.

Let me put the comparisons this way: the bill pitbulllady is referring to hopes to eradicate all large snakes from captivity simply because of a problem that will NOT expand from one state, which is Florida. Supporters and sponsors of the bill are basically dictating what everyone must think, lying to everyone that it's to protect the people and the environment, when, in reality, a) dogs and cats have done much worse in captivity than large snakes ever will, and b) the bill will do nothing to eradicate the problem it was based on. Additionally, some supporters of the bill have been linked to domestic terrorism. But I digress on that topic; I don't want this thread to turn into a political argument. :?

In comparison, the CDA, though there are obviously no bills we are familiar with in the Monster World legislative process, constantly exploit fear of humans, also by way of manipulation every so often, as proven by Roz's lines when Waternoose is exposed. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if they knew about a certain character's banishment and decided to cover THAT up as well. :?

Sounds similar, anyone? Though Pixar probably wasn't keeping this in mind (after all, the anti-pet movement wasn't in full swing quite yet when this movie was released), it does a good job of applying to the TRUE political and media-based conspiracies, as opposed to theories like politicians being reptilian aliens, which, aside from being ridiculous, is ironically another example of exploitation of fear of reptiles.
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Postby Nexas » Sat Jan 02, 2010 1:29 am

With the rough treatment, lets just hope that Celia had the sorta 'cone of shame' like Dug had, and NOT that she sprained her neck because of C.D.A. treatment.

The C.D.A. is indeed a governmental agency, but are also set under the foundation of their organization. Child Detection Agency. This refers to the Scare Industry, and as such they are under the heads of that industry, which in itself is the most powerful corporation in the monster world.
They generally have the power to do what they want, apparently without question. They can KILL a human child if the needs come to it, look what they did to a sock. They can DESTROY an ENTIRE BUILDING...from an urgent RUMOR from a chef with no direct evidence of a human child being there. They can COVER UP the worst commitable crime in the monster world and nobody bats an eye.
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Postby Princess_Darkness » Sat Jan 02, 2010 4:36 am

Everyone has made some very good points so far...thank you pitbulllady for pointing out that about Waternoose's fear of the CDA, if the CDA wasn't in a governnmental position then obviously Waternoose wouldn't be too worried about them...although Nexas did bring something up actually in which that the CDA work under the scare industry...not sure if this would matter but on the 100 door game on the MI blu-ray disc, when you get up to about level seven, according to this game, that would qualify you for the job of CDA in the factory ( the whole point of the game is to take trivia questions as if you were doing a job interview)...while I'm not sure if you could include this game to be considered any valuable information in relation to the film and the monster world, I just thought that was something of interest...
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Postby pitbulllady » Sat Jan 02, 2010 5:43 pm

Princess_Darkness wrote:Everyone has made some very good points so far...thank you pitbulllady for pointing out that about Waternoose's fear of the CDA, if the CDA wasn't in a governnmental position then obviously Waternoose wouldn't be too worried about them...although Nexas did bring something up actually in which that the CDA work under the scare industry...not sure if this would matter but on the 100 door game on the MI blu-ray disc, when you get up to about level seven, according to this game, that would qualify you for the job of CDA in the factory ( the whole point of the game is to take trivia questions as if you were doing a job interview)...while I'm not sure if you could include this game to be considered any valuable information in relation to the film and the monster world, I just thought that was something of interest...


I don't think that the CDA worked UNDER the Scare industry, but OVER it, in that they were the ones to oversee everything that went on with that industry. In that respect, they were similar to our EPA, the Environmental Protection Agency, which oversees several different industries here in the US, industries that have the potential to generate pollutants. It's the EPA's job to monitor factories, farms, etc., to make sure that this does not happen beyond the levels that they themselves set forth. The EPA has the authority to shut down a business immediately if there's a problem. However, the EPA does not have powers of arrest, as do the CDA. They can only file require businesses/operations to be shut down, and can levy fines and file lawsuits, but they can't arrest anyone. MOST governments have some form of bureaucratic groups in place to monitor various activities relating to work, production, agriculture, etc. Utilities companies like M.I. that depend on Scream energy to generate electricity for their clients are naturally at the greatest risk of that presumed child invasion, so naturally such places would be where the CDA would concentrate their attention. Still, from what we see in the movie, their power goes way beyond just doing that. They have the power to control the press, to arrest individuals and are not held accountable for injuries to citizens incurred as a result of their activities. If they were simply an off-shoot of the Scare industry set up to self-monitor safety issues, that wouldn't be the case. If the CDA were formed BY the Scare industry, then it would accountable to that industry, which means that the industry's leaders would still call the shots and basically the CDA could do nothing except make recommendations, but without the full backing of the government, at the state or national level, they'd have no real power at all. There would be no reason to fear them.

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Postby mentalguru » Sat Jan 02, 2010 6:36 pm

Yes, during the events of the movie at least- the CDA does have a great amount of power and these powers could only really come with governmental backing. They wouldn't get away with that kind of thing without that sort of support if they were just a division of the company. And it uses and abuses this power A LOT in just a few examples in the movie.

For instance if the CDA WAS just a division of the companies at that point- they wouldn't be able to pull off that kind of thing they did on Harry Hausen's and it's patrons/employees at all, it would be out of their juristiction probably. They also handle investigations it seems which we see when they show Waternoose the bag Sulley left behind, and are 'detectives'. The restaurant sushi chopper called up the CDA- rather like a 999 or 911 call it seems too when he was yelling about Boo down the phone- it's something perhaps people are taught even outside the company- who knows, their phone number is probably 2319 itself! Plus Waternoose has no sway with them like than anyone else in the movie... he can't boss them around like certain other people. If he wanted them in his pocket, possibly the best thing he could do would be to BRIBE them (a bit of a risk if he doesn't know how they'll react), and even then he could only bribe specific MEMBERS rather than the whole GROUP, (because even his cash would quite possibly be pittence to a group so powerful) or alternatively- as he tried in the movie, the other option is to TRICK them- like he did, where he tried to make out it was either Sulley or Mike or alternatively Randall doing this on his own.(*)

It's just a fact when it comes to the power- the CDA has more than Waternoose. And as CEO... Waternoose is pretty high in the company as it is. If they were just workers for the company- he could tell them to back off on some level or he wouldn't at least fear them as much. They can shut down a scare floor WITHOUT his permission- he doesn't argue against them when they do it (although he does not seem pleased at ALL about it), because he knows he CAN'T. He despises the CDA because... well they are NOT impressed or swayed by his powers or position, and it probably slightly sickens him inside since he's a bit of an egomaniac ("Don't you know who I am?") that THESE people probably with 'no breeding' have power over HIM. He doesn't like this at all- and only yells at them when he's being arrested. (Something else the CDA have power to do so as mentioned by PBL... and not a citizen's kind of arrest either... -raises brow- Oh no, they take him away in the back of their van with handcuffs.)

It's possible that (once) the only response to the threat of human contamination once was a private disinfection thing by the scare companies, but quickly the government decided such things are just too DANGEROUS to be left in private hands- the people had to be 'protected'. But once the toxicity effect eventually disappeared (probably due to good old immune systems kicking in), the rumours were probably kept up, and the CDA to keep appearances it seems goes through the whole mess of being rough to their victims... uh I mean de-contaminees. It is possible that there is partially SOME 'good' motives (the real fear being that too curious monsters would expose their world to adult humans if toxicity didn't hold them back, so it's to protect the monster world in a different way), but POWER ITSELF, through fear is likely another reason and a major driver. Plus, even with the 'good' reason- it's just a fact they STILL over abuse their power too much by how rough they act- as mentioned they should have been firm but gentle with George and tell him to lie down- he wasn't even putting up a fight at ALL.

The thing is- it seems like Roz KNOWS humans aren't toxic too, by the very fact she doesn't seem to care much for the fact that Sulley is HOLDING a human child, even giving him '5 minutes' to say goodbye! (Which would in a monster who believed the threat of toxicity, sound insane to offer at all), and yet in the end... Sulley doesn't even get the old shave and cone treatment like George did over a SOCK- probably because people would possibly get to suspicious of both Mike and Sulley wandering around like old George and Celia had to and wonder what on earth happened. It wasn't in their best interests to treat the pair that way- as well as reducing perhaps the likelihood they'd stay quiet perhaps- and unable to manipulate a potential ally. But THOSE pair, George and Celia (among others) were actually put through that 'treatment' to keep up appearances that they still saw the threat as REAL.

Man the CDA are really interesting aren't they? I kind of want to learn more about them...

But yeah, during the MOVIE events at least, I kind of doubt they're a private thing myself- too much power for that. If you can get in Waternoose's way without getting burned or even him TRYING to 'burn' you... well... you're pretty powerful then!

--

(*)After all old Waternoose had no way of knowing who had the kid at that specific time- he just didn't CARE who had the kid- as long as he got off, so he was quite prepared to sell out Randall if it came to it.
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Postby lizardgirl » Sat Jan 02, 2010 11:34 pm

I've always been a bit unsure of the CDA...Purely from a movie audience's point of view. they were obviously designed as a form of making fun of other organisations similar to the CDA that we have in real life, showing how inefficient and over-the-top they can be.

But if you look at it from inside the movie, so to speak. it does appear that the CDA has a darker side, and, as others have said, there are many hints to this throughout the film. They're powerful, even overiding Waternoose's actions, and they seem to know a lot more than they're letting on.

My only real confusion comes when questioning why most of them, (actually, pretty much all of them aside from Roz, I think) seem to be bumbling idiots. Surely an organisation with such power and (probably) money would hire better employees?

But going back to being a member of the audience, this was probably done by Pixar to exagerrate their short-comings and to say, 'this sort of thing happens here as well, we just don't know about it!'
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Postby mentalguru » Sun Jan 03, 2010 12:51 am

I don't get the impression that MOST of the employees are 'bumbling idiots' at ALL actually myself LG, I think you're wrong there- the one time they make the stupid mistake is jumping at the sock which Mike throws, and it seems almost... instinctive in that case, and one little moment where they ask Sulley for an autograph, but that last one is more showing the CDA as actual PEOPLE too... really in the end (after all, they had no reason to suspect Sulley at that time), which is a nice touch actually- gives another dimension to them- shows some of these guys have kids since that one wanted an autograph to his daughter. Though when you think about it that almost adds the dimension of the nazi coming home to his loving family, sort of twisted in it's own way as well- though I do agree this was probably unintentional from an audience standpoint.

But overall I just get the impression they're incredibly over the top and ROUGH really most of the time. NOT bumbling idiots at all- only a few- most of them actually seem more or less competent at their work, but very abusive. Very uncaring too.

You've a point though, as already mentioned, it probably wasn't Pixar's original INTENTION for the CDA to come off this way- but regardless, from any realistic standpoint, they're pretty terrible. It really confuses me that apparently they're part of the 'good guy's' squad... when it's WAY too easy to see them as the real bad guys all along (and you thought the surprise was WATERNOOSE being the one behind it all... XD)..

(Then again considering my favourte character, Sulley's actions as well as Mike's towards a certain other monster... perhaps we shouldn't be surprised? OH SNAP.)

Granted, I view the CDA as having fantastic potnetial as antagonists in a sequel- it's just way too EASY not to do so given the evidence.

I could see a Sulley as CEO being used by the CDA in some way myself- he's probably a well liked public figure... someone they could use to their advantage certainly.

The thing is- the CDA, just like Sulley and Mike's exile of Randall, which doesn't make any sense in context not to be illegal, are both something I view to be Pixar's version of 'Lewis' lamppost'- basically Lewis himself only wrote one book of Narnia, but then a FAN asked what on earth a Victorian lamp post was doing there- and he wrote the series as a result of just trying to answer that very question. Which is pretty awesome when you think about it.

Perhaps Pixar could do the same- because when it comes down to it, it wouldn't make a lot of sense in a world with trials for what happened Randall tobe LEGAL or for the CDAs actions not to be on SOME level disturbing, and the fact is- it's not that good idea just to stick in random humour if it means the rules of the very universe you've created are broken, or detracts from an important moral message- you have to be careful sometimes how you go about that- it's why Harry Potter basically failed for me as a series in the end.

And the fact is despite being set in a universe where monsters use human kids laughter or screams for energy- it's their most real setting to date- something missing in other Pixar movies, because it's set in the WORK PLACE from beginning to end, and it's where the most important events occur and has things which kind of could happen in some capacity- the boss who acts nice but isn't what he seems etc. and all that.

It's more relateable than other Pixar movies in their situations- since they are definitly closer to things that COULD happen to us- we'll never be superheroes (sorry if I burst anyones bubble), we'll probably never do the balloons journey or travels miles and miles in search of a missing kid, and it's doubtful many here are 'racers'- but company or boss underhandedness/illegal activity and governmental sneakiness? Pretty dark, but on the whole while in some cases extreme, a lot closer to something other people might face and are actually currently facing today all the time. Because... it takes place in the WORKPLACE- an area where everyone will have to face at some stage. And it's FAR more likely that someone here will be placed in Randall's or Sulley's position than for any other Pixar character I could care to name in Western society. (You know, doing illegal activity for a boss and being insulted by said boss/finding out that someone you cared for and trusted doesn't care about you much at all when it comes to the crunch and wasn't what he seemed) Remy/Lingini perhaps in some cases though does indeed come close to certain situations people might find themselves in however.

In other words- M.I. is far from perfect, but it's still my favourite due to the characters, the world created which is so similar and yet different to our own as well as the fantastic potential it has for a sequel in some respects.

I just wish that Pixar would see the potential of the CDA as an antagonist- it would be pretty awesome IMO if they did this instead of bringing Randall in as the antagonist- which would be tired and stale and incredibly boring as an option.

Even in the recent 'extended canon' comics it seems... the way the CDA act is even worse and pretty disgusting (and doesn't even really have much humorous 'bumbling' at all it seems), though unfortunatly, the writers don't seem to see that.
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Re: The CDA: dark or not?

Postby Sally12 » Sun Aug 18, 2019 8:20 pm

I am not a big fan os these pictures, they grossed me out. I don’t know why but somehow they reminded me of ultius. I hate rats, even when they are in a photo that’s why I am grossed out by them.
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