Academy Awards 2011

The Common Room Film, Television, Music & Books
#21

Well, yeah. They weren’t quite as good as Up. Nothing to be ashamed about.

I think most people mean it when they say they’re just happy to be nominated. No one would’ve ever known about The Secret of Kells if it hadn’t been nominated for best animated feature last year.

No, I think the academy knows it more than most people do, and that was why they created it in the first place. They did it with good intentions, but it unfortunately has in practice been used as a ghetto for animated films up until recently.

Yes, I don’t deny that sometimes the academy resorts to politics in defining what a “supporting” and a “lead” role are (Hailee Steinfeld this year, for example). But there isn’t a direct contradiction between an animated feature and a motion picture in general like there is between the separate categories for lead and supporting roles. An animated feature is incontrovertibly also a motion picture, while not every “supporting actor” can also be considered a lead actor and vice versa.

Well, I would argue that Toy Story 3 succeeded on the technique and artistry just as much as Tangled did. The humans were vastly improved over the original installments, and there were many setpieces like the opening scene and the furnace that were just awe-inspiring. Plus it had a stronger story to go with it.

So what do you think makes something the best “foreign” film? How accurate the subtitles are?

There’s no “double pegging” here. Separate departments vote on the Best Picture and the Best Animated Feature, and they don’t know what the other department is going to vote for. It’s not the academy’s fault that Tangled got the shaft. There were only three slots this year and they simply preferred three animated films over Tangled.

Yu’re comparing a crudely-animated comedy series to a $200 million budget Pixar production. Do you realize what that sounds like? You’re making Toy Story 3 seem like it’s one of those low-budget Lionsgate animated movies.

Either way, it’s hard to argue that the Emmys’ idea of “Outstanding Animated Program” is really much in agreement with yours seeing as Family Guy was nominated for that category a year before they were nominated for best Comedy series, and some of that category’s other nominees include South Park, Robot Chicken, and Seth MacFarlane’s own American Dad. From the way it looks, they just have a rule that something can’t be nominated for best comedy series and best animated program, regardless of what merits it has in technical or writing quality.

#22

Once again, tribefan has said pretty much what I had to say, but I’ll add one thing:

On the contrary. The fact that it’s a category, proves it is a medium and not a genre. If they were making genres into categories, then there would be nominations for Best Western, Best Horror Film, Best Adventure Film…

#23

Well for one thing I don’t think there should even be a foreign language category. But that’s a whole other ball of wax. If a film is exceptional it will get into the Best Picture race no matter what. The nomination only exist to create the pretense that the show is not completely Anglophone-centric.

I guess for the most reason I can’t get behind either of the nominations, Up’s or Toy Story’s 3 is that I truly don’t think either were really that fantastic that they deserve double nominations or to be frontrunners in the Best Animated category. Of course this is only my opinion. (I mean it truly is) You’ll find more Kim Jong-il supporters in America than you’ll find people who don’t think those two films were all that fantastic.

But I’m going to have to opt out of this one because I’m not going to find anyone who agrees with me here or anywhere. Everyone thinks this thing is well-deserved while I see it as a farce and a borderline fiasco. I wouldn’t wish this on any picture, even ones I love (and believe it or not guys, this movie is one of them. I was crying in the aisles along with you) but my Devil’s advocate’s sessions is being even less well-received than the one by poor Mr. Reeves.

If anyone needs me I’ll be writing angry letters the editors of trade mags. ;-p

#24

If you’d just admitted that was why you were so upset in the first place, we could’ve avoided this mess. :wink:

#25

-And the nominees are:

True Grit

Jonah Hex

-And the winner is True Grit, and by winner we mean the only film able to obtain a RT score of over 20%.

#26

HAHA. I can’t stop laughing.

#27

Yeah. But the reason why I didn’t reveal the fact was because I didn’t want you to automatically assume bias. Even though bias doesn’t even really enter the picture. Now that I’ve revealed it my entire argument is thus even more moot as well as null and void in the eyes of everyone on the board due to assumed bias.

It’s hard to acquit the defendant when the jury already thinks he’s a criminal.

Admittedly I care about these things a lot more about these award shows than anyone else I know who doesn’t make a living off of them or directly involved. It’s kind of pathetic.

My entire day was wrecked because of the nominations. And I talked about them to anyone who would listen. I was upset that I even missed the simulcast.

Still, with the amount of dust-up I hear about every other nomination in every other category with none at all about what I have the biggest problem with, it was a foolish thing to even open my mouth.

I guess some things are best kept to myself. Like my plan to systematically defeat the Justice League.

#28

It’s not null and void. I think the whole Animated/Picture thing was worth debating anyway since it’s an issue that I strongly disagree with you on and feel the need to respond to.

The thing is, I think you are letting your anger at Tangled getting shafted influence your vitriol towards Toy Story 3’s nomination. Even by your definition of a great animated feature it’s a bit of a stretch to say that Toy Story 3 wasn’t that great a technical accomplishment.

#29

Much vitriol would be had even if it were Tangled in its place. You wanna know what movie I most remember from the Oscars back when Crouching Tiger was nominated twice? Crouching Tiger! I’m still upset about it getting nominated twice.

I’m also upset it lost out to Gladiator in the Best Picture category as it was obviously the superior film in just about every way.

Out of the five nominations from that year I’m more likely to watch Lee’s masterpiece.

That still doesn’t change the fact that it had something of an unfair advantage in either category.

As for technical achievement, don’t get me wrong Toy Story had more than a few strong points. But it’s kind of par for the course. We know that Pixar gets better incrementally with every film they release. However, Tangled was a quantum leap forward when you compare it to any of Disney’s prior CGI efforts. Dreamworks has been experimenting with “camerawork” more than just about any major Western player, but other than KFP, a lot of it seemed either too passive or gimmicky. KFP was a huge step in the right direction with its tribute to the HK wuxia epics. But that work was blown away by HTTYD, I don’t think I’ve seen flying scenes with that much visceral impact in a cinema in the near quarter century I’ve been alive. The art direction for both was just so inspired and breathtaking.

Not to say that TS3 is without its merits. Back in July after I had first seen the film I got into a deep conversation with my friend about how they made subtle but beautiful nods to the lighting, composition and color of prison movies in some of the scenes. And the incinerator sequence was just handsome as heck. But after time went by those scenes aren’t as fixed in my mind as the subtle nuances in Rapunzel’s face or the feeling like the wind was in my hair when Hiccup and Toothless dived like a peregrine falcon.

You can be a very huge fan of something and still find it overrated, overpraised or continuous streams of accolades a bit exhausting.

Because yes, I would’ve pursued this issue even if Animated had 5 slots instead of 3 and Tangled was nominated after all. The only thing missing would’ve been the worthy film knock out portion.

I’m now wicked hungry but too dang lazy to actually do anything about it. I guess I could eat some crow.

#30

I don’t think I’m ever going to completely understand your views on this. By “unfair advantage” you mean that it makes it a foregone conclusion that it wins the foreign category, right? Again, I doubt the other nominees are so vehemently against this like you are. Indeed, Dreamworks launched a Best Picture campaign for How to Train Your Dragon this year, encouraged by Up’s nomination.

#31

It’s not Toy Story 3’s fault that Tangled wasn’t nominated. It was the Academy voters who wrote on their ballots what they watned to be nominated. Some saw ‘Best Animated Feature’ and voted Toy Story 3. Then they got to Best Feature and thought hmm, Toy Story 3 also! It’s not like Toy Story 3 took Tangled hostage to it could be double nominated…

#32

Look guys, I get it. You can stop with the rebuttals now. I’m literally the only person on Earth who has a problem with this. Every other thing AMPAS does is up for question except for these two instances 2 years in a row.

Pete’s sake it’s like I tarred and feathered Schindler’s List or something. Not even, I’ve seen people on that boat.

There is truly no equivalent example in media that I can possibly think of. I should make one:

COMING SOON

He was a man with a mission!

“I’m just saying that Fruity Pebbles shouldn’t be in both the cereal and candy aisles. It’s one or the other!”

“Sir, I don’t stock the shelves. It’s done by an independent skeleton crew in the dead of night!”

He had no one to turn to!

“I’m telling you, Martha. It’s like a vast conspiracy. Everything fits together. I can crack this! I know I can crack this!”

“What happened to the man I loved! This thing is driving you crazy!”

“The man you love is gone. The double stocking of items nationwide has killed him!”

“SOBS NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!”

There was nowhere to run!

“You’re in too deep now. The best you can hope for is to wake up with a concussion in the hospital one day thinking it was all a dream!”

“Heh. We’ll see about that”

“Who are you going to report us to? This goes all the way to the top!”

UNTIL----

“ZOUNDS! You’ve found me! How was is possible?”

“I knew it was you from the beginning, it all makes perfect sense…”

MONTAGE OF DRAMATIC AND EXCITING MOMENTS

“It all makes…”

MONTAGE CONTINUED:

“Perfect sense…”

Cut to black.

Bleed title:

OVERREACTION

A new film by Christopher Nolan.

This Summer.

MMMyep. This is going to make a coveted Black List position for sure. Money please, Hollywood!

#33

We’re having a disucssion on a public forum. We have every right to say our opinion just as much as you do.

#34

I’m aware. But seeing as I’m the only one who has a different opinion and since I’ve already been bested at least 12 times in this forum alone I don’t need everyone’s parting shot. I’ve already lost.

Plus, I’m running out of cheeky self-deprecating things to say about myself to cushion my punctured pride at the end of all these messages.

Unless you guys want to donate to my Self-Deprecation fund. Do you? For only one self-insult a day you’ll be helping a poor childish American survive into tomorrow.

Eh, I’m way too lazy for this insert parody of overwrought emotionally manipulative charity commercial here

Edit: Wowsers, I can’t believe this was my 1000th post. What an ignominious entry.

#35

I don’t understand what is happening. You’re very grim these days, aerostarmonk. You’re supposed to be one of the “funniest members” :unamused:

#36

I guess I’m wondering when did I become unfunny or grim? So far I’ve only vehemently disagreed with you guys and felt a little backed into a corner. But I’ve also taken the entire thing in stride to the best of my very limited ability and poked fun at myself throughout the entire thread for even bringing up the issue.

I mean I’ve compared myself to bitter old folks who write pointless letters to editors about stuff that really doesn’t matter and Patrick Bateman.

But people are only focusing on the whole double nomination issue. Frankly, I’d rather hear some commentary on my idea of introducing a new technical category for Best Animation and a new acting category for Best Voice Acting. As there is almost no drama in that subject and I think we can all agree that these categories should at least exist in some form or another.

Which is why I’m going for the derail and reintroducing the subject.

Your picks for Best Animation and Best Voice Acting guys.

5 picks for animation, 10 picks for voice acting. Yes, actors can get multiple nods in the same category and even for the same film. But I’d rather they didn’t.

No deprecation here. I’m spent. I guess I could close with a joke though.

So an electron walks into a bar and the bartender says, “Hey buddy, you seem a bit down.”
The electron replies, “Why do you say that?”
The bartender answers, “Nothing much. It just seems like you’re a little negative.”

Nerd humor. The best kind of humor. :smiley:

Edit: Here’s a bit of fun: Can you name the Best Pic nominees depicted in Lego without captions?

#37

Um…sorry. I actually agree with aerostarmonk. :neutral_face: Tangled deserved something, no matter how awesome TS3 was. :unamused: Nothing needs to be nominated for both categories. In fact, best animated feature shouldn’t exist, IMO. That’s no reason to pick o9n aero. Yes, we can all share our opinions. But, that includes unpopular opinions. Being socially "wrong"is not grounds for someone to be stoned. :confused:

No one attack me, either. I’ll leave this thread now.

(what day and channel do the Oscars come on?)

#38

Don’t fight guys. We all share common interests. Lets just be calm

#39

Tangled did get something. It was nominated for best original song.

But obviously you don’t think it deserved something that much if you think best animated feature shouldn’t exist.

#40

This is what he wants! The bald golden homewrecker! He’s manipulated us from the beginning. Playing us against one another waiting for the pieces to fall so he can move in and set up shop!

No, Oscar! Not today! Not EVAR!

Come on guys, I think we’ve all said what needed to be said about that tangent of conversation. We’ve all aired our views. Some of us got more hot under the collar than others. I’m not naming names. coughAEROcough

But I think for the good of our frankly otherwise fantastic community we shouldn’t let this turn into another '12 Presidential election thread. Because at the end of the day, I can pop in Dragon or Tangled instead of Toy Story 3. I can turn on the Tron soundtrack and watch the special features that delve into the editing process of Inception and the special effects of Scott Pilgrim. Preferably, not all at the same time as that would be confusing. The only difference is that there will be a special mark on some of the boxes instead of others. This isn’t end of the world type stuff. And if I’m going to hurt someone’s feelings or feel insulted I’d rather it be over something that actually directly affects my life rather than who’s holding some statuette come the end of next month.

If we’re going to debate anything maybe we should talk about the actual nominees instead of who snubbed who or who got an accidental double peg. As that’s all in the past.

Or at least carry on to the discussion I suggested with the hypothetical categories of Best Animation and Best Voice Acting.

If not we’re going to need Henry Kissinger at next month’s Movie Night. And nobody wants that. Even if he does have a sexy voice…