Central Brave Discussion

Pixar's Feature Films Brave
#1721

Great post, Autumn! As you said, male-fronted films tend to be gender neutral (for whatever reason…) and some people might find the relationship Merida has with her mother possibly difficult to comprehend or uninteresting, but I think I will find that quite intriguing to see in a film because I can relate to it so much.

I was actually browsing the Brave IMDb boards for the first time earlier today before all this was brought up, and I admit I got a little worried that this movie might just be okay. I’m intrigued at the idea of a mother-daughter relationship, which is so rare for animated films and usually only involves an evil “mother” character. Really! Try to come up with an animated film that has a significant mother-daughter relationship, and you will find the task to be difficult. Coraline’s pretty much what I came up with. However, there are a lot of dynamics to that relationship and there’s much to be explored. I also don’t mind the little twist mentioned earlier, as long as it’s executed well; that will obviously be the bones of the story.

#1722

I wish it wasn’t that way, but that seems to be just how it is, sometimes. Maybe that’s part of why it’s taken so long to get a female-fronted Pixar movie. Movies with male protagonists are often seen as gender-neutral. Girls can relate to boys having adventures, apparently, but boys can’t relate to a plot that prominently features a mom? :frowning:

But at least that imdb user admitted that’s why he may have had a hard time. As a girl (and a girl who had a tumultuous relationship with her mom when she was younger), I’m not afraid of having the same problem relating. I am afraid of whether that problem will kick in among reviewers and audiences, though.
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I thought it was the guys how were suppose to get into the adventures. I’m still going to see the film even if it’s mostly on the mom and Merida.

#1723

I hate that she does. That disappoints me. :frowning:

#1724

^ It dissapoints me too. I was really hoping that it wasn’t true…

#1725

The Japanese trailer has something offensive to me. That’s strike two.

#1726

They really took the easy out with the plot apparently.

#1727

Why are so many people disapointed about the bear thing? I admit it’s not good but it’s not going to ruin the film or something.

#1728

I am disappointed about the bear thing. :cry:

#1729

I feel it could ruin the film. It just doesn’t appeal to me at all.

#1730

I’m not really too disappointed with the bear thing.

#1731

It already ruined it for me.

The film could be great, and I still will hate that plot for ever. Can’t help it.

#1732

The bear thing is one of the few decent things I know about this movie so far.

#1733

I think it has something to do with the relationship with her. Maybe it’s suppose to get her closer to her mom, in the clip you see they get mad at each other and she is not mad at her dad or brothers. The only problem is the [spoil]brother’s turn into bears[/spoil] too.

#1734

My theory on the [spoil]brothers becoming bears[/spoil] is pretty simple – obviously have no idea if it’s correct though. [spoil]In the bio of them on the website, they’re depicted as very mischievous and always looking for sweets. I would argue that that may turn out to be extremely relevant – I predict that Merida gets the potion from the witch and, say, slips some into her mom’s drink. But the triplets, in the process of raiding the pantry or something, get into the rest of it and drink from it, and manage to get the spell laid on them too.[/spoil]

As far as the bear thing goes at all, I guess you could say I’m a little alarmed at how easily a bunch of you guys are dismissing a movie none of us have seen based on that – I get that there’s a lot of pre-dismissal of this movie going around, in a lot of places. Like I said a few pages back, over plot points being done before, or the plot as a whole being too facile.

I don’t expect to change any minds with this post, but I just wanted to throw down my thoughts as a little perspective about the bear thing. :slight_smile: And transformation stories. And how this is one major thing that Pixar got right, and how this fits right into the Northern European folklore vibe they told us back in '08 we were going to be seeing. Because transformation stories are tied right up with folklore in so many cultures but in Northern Europe the creature involved in the transformation always seems to be a bear. I’m talking “East of the Sun, West of the Moon”, at least two different Grimm stories that I can think of, the Norse “Böðvar Bjarki” character in the Hrólfs saga kraka. And if you’re going to go with a very famous story that descended right from those old myths, how about The Hobbit, and the character of Beorn, the shape-changer who could turn into a bear?

Usually in these stories it’s the hero/ine or the love interest who goes through the transformation. But this isn’t “Beauty and the Beast” or “Princess and the Frog” or “Brother Bear”. I think it’s fascinating to have [spoil]the transformed person be the mom[/spoil]. We’ve also been given no indication that [spoil]Elinor will be able to verbally communicate with Merida[/spoil] after the transformation. We may in fact be in store for some expressive acting through looks and gestures on her part, and we saw how well that turned out in Wall-E.

Basically, this is just another trope that’s as old as storytelling. Just like the spell gone wrong, the seeking of the wise woman, the fact that there’s three of everything in this movie. I don’t think that’s taking the cheap way out, or recycling. And actually, recycling tropes is as old as storytelling, too :wink: Just part of folklore.

#1735

I’m not dismissing the movie, because I haven’t seen it. But I’m dismissing that plot, because transformations are a pet peeve of mine.

I can still like the film, but I won’t be able to get to like that plot.

#1736

That’s pretty much the way I feel too^^. I’m not saying the film will be bad, I just really don’t like that plot.

#1737

I’m with you, Autumn. The nature of the transformation could have a lot of potential to be moving and interesting. I don’t think transforming into an animal will be like other Disney movies.

#1738

I must clear up that I don’t dislike the transformation plot because it has been done before, but because I dislike the concept per se.

#1739

I’m sure I’ll love this movie. That might even not bother me. It just…doe now…

#1740

I wonder if the King will be a bear. I don’t think they showed him yet. He’ll be huge if he does.