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What About the Ladies?

Talk about Pixar's upcoming features including any other confirmed, unnamed, or rumored projects here until enough discussion has been generated to warrant their own forum.

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Postby soue1313 » Sat Dec 27, 2008 9:55 pm

So true, Al-Bob! I got Wall-E 3-Disc Special Edition and the video game on PS2! I'm going to post a photo of them both as soon as possible. I was going to post about this topic but my mom's making me get off. Ihave to help someone move in. :roll: :(
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Postby TS2 » Mon Jun 08, 2009 5:14 pm

Glyph wrote:And yes, I AM complaining about it. In most animated movies there is only 1 prominent female character. Because this character represents her entire $ex, they have to make her perfect in every way: not too smart, not too stupid, not too nice, not too mean, not too pretty, but not ugly either. The result is usually a BORING CHARACTER. There are some exceptions, like Dory and Atta. Those characters had regular personalities. Most women in Pixar movies are boring though. They're just stereotypical girlfriend characters. Everyone complains about movies under representing minorities, but the sexism in the movie industry is worse. As we all know, women are not a minority and they never have been. There is no good reason for having so few animated female characters.

The biggest problem is that there are no women on the story team at Pixar. Women seem to be more interested in experimental animation than character animation, and men find it much easier to write male characters than female characters.

When a discussion like this shows up, somebody usually argues that boys do not want to see a movie starring a woman. This is BS. Boys don't want to see overly girlish movies such as The Little Mermaid. But if you make a woman the star of a movie like Lilo and Stitch, boys have no problem watching it. Basically boys want to see fighting, so if you put women in more action orientated roles boys will watch it.


There are many women in the story department at PIXAR! How dare you soil the good name of PIXAR just because they haven't had a character that you see as 'a good female character.' All of PIXAR's stories are personal and created from the directors' mind. The fact that they don't all have female leads is just coincidence. You must have never seen The Incredibles, because Elastagirl has an amazing arc and great acting in animation.

Besides, you're getting The Bear and the Bow pretty soon, which is written and directed by 2 women! This argument is pointless.

Again, how dare you!!!
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Postby FounderofAzn » Tue Jun 09, 2009 4:50 am

Oh, wonderful. The sexism topic has made It's way into my favorite animation studio. Joy.

I'm one of those people who enjoys a good movie whether the protagonist is a dude or a female. I guess the only time I actually loved a movie because of a heroine is Mulan.
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Postby Roflcoptinator » Mon Jun 29, 2009 4:38 am

....... never really noticed...

Well if anyone mentioned there's Bear and the Bow....
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Postby luxoIII » Fri Jul 24, 2009 6:44 pm

Yep. Already in progress. I'm sure there will be lots more to come. It's good to have different genders, races, and ethnicities as main characters. Of course you can't really play a race card on Pixar, with only two PREDOMINANTLY human casts, and ratatouille had a good bit of humans. Gender is something they should attend to so as not to look like sexists, although you could argue their male-based storylines have been pretty good. All in all, you should have both as main characters and pixar has adressed this.
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Postby ellie-jessie-eve » Sun May 16, 2010 8:26 am

I don't really mind the lack of female leads, I don't ever really noticed it.

I did find this article intreresting though, and thought of it when I was reading everyone's comments in this topic. You should read it, it's very biased, but fun to read.

It deals with the lack of female leads, and the 'Strong' females (EVE, Colette,Sally) having more important goals that are overrshadowed.

While the opinions expressed in this article are not mine, I still found it to be very interesting and brought up different view points, especially the issue of WALL-E/EVE.

http://filthygrandeur.blogspot.com/2009 ... cters.html
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Postby Chao » Sun May 16, 2010 6:17 pm

FounderofAzn wrote:Oh, wonderful. The sexism topic has made It's way into my favorite animation studio. Joy.

I'm one of those people who enjoys a good movie whether the protagonist is a dude or a female. I guess the only time I actually loved a movie because of a heroine is Mulan.


This. Oh so much this.
As someone who has girly parts, I really, really, don't give a d**n about whether or not there's a central female character in a movie. Just give me characters who I can look at say that they're real people with real depth.

And Myiazaki/Ghibli uses very, very similar central females, almost to the point where you can say that they're the same character, but oh, nobody cares, because they're all central characters! :roll:

And I that link didn't even mention Ellie, who I'd say pretty has a pretty big, if subtle, presence in the story over Up. Really, without her, you wouldn't have the movie.

Edited for swearing - TDIT
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Postby IncredigirlVirginia » Sat May 29, 2010 3:39 am

Does it matter?? I thought Jessie, Helen( Elastigirl), Violet, Dory, EVE, Collette, and dozens of others were pretty big. I'm sick of this argument; I've seen it on hundreds of psychology websites. As previously stated by our smarter members, Brave. Period. And the lead is always likeable, cute, and real. That's what counts; the heart, not the parts.
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Postby ellie-jessie-eve » Sat May 29, 2010 4:27 am

Chao wrote:
And I that link didn't even mention Ellie, who I'd say pretty has a pretty big, if subtle, presence in the story over Up. Really, without her, you wouldn't have the movie.

Edited for swearing - TDIT


I don't know if you're refering to my link, but if you are it was published before Up came out to theaters, so the author hadn't seen the movie to discuss Ellie.
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Postby mentalguru » Sun May 30, 2010 5:18 pm

I don't believe Pixar to be overtly sexist generally speaking as a studio (but could certain individuals be who work for them out of the vast many which do?, Of course, they're not of the borg mind after all and odds are at least a few of them are if even mildly. As long as they don't let it show too much in their work, not much which can be said about it.).

I would indeed like to see a show where a female character was THE main character of course, and Brave is hopefully going to show that. I'm quite looking forward to it actually.

Granted it has to be said there is usually a REASON why so many studios and stories (NOT just Pixar) have so many males as THE main character not to mention the fact the gender divide is definitly not 50/50. This isn't JUST Pixar but... nearly everywhere.

There's economics to think of really for one (if we're getting REALLY general here, not just Pixar and we think about those just in it for the big bucks.)

It's apparently a lot easier for girl viewers to relate to a character regardless of gender. Apparently generally speaking boys are supposed to find it harder to do that (possible reasons are numerous, personally I like to blame society for somehow making it taboo for blokes to act in any way sensitive or relate and put themselves in the same place mentally as a woman. Lame society is lame.). This of course is not true for all boys/guys (or girls for that matter) but generally speaking? Apparently so. Girls are also (apparently) supposed to find it easier to WRITE guys unlike the other way around (once again, there are exceptions, but this seems to be something I've heard thrown around by my english teacher when I was still in school.).

BUT there is also the gross double standard some people hold characters in terms of gender when they are actually out there. Take hypothetical character X- A strong male character with certain characteristics. That character is 'badass'. Change his gender. Suddenly he (I mean... SHE) is a Mary Sue or is as annoying as hell to many of the exact same people for some reason. Sure you do get some Gary Stus called out on, but female characters are more likely to get the label of being too 'perfect'. Even when they DON'T deserve it and its untrue. The mis-labelling happens at a far higher rate than for the male characters.

Not to say that real Mary Sues or Gary Stus don't exist (of course they do.) But not all of them are.

Female characters in general just don't get a break. They're either 'too weak', 'too strong', 'too good at what they do', 'pathetic and useless'... it sometimes seems female characters just can't win. Sad.

Heck, I've just realised that MOST (not all) of my favourite characters tend to be male too. Not all of them, but most of them. A part of this could be due to the fact the shows/movies were very male heavy to begin with (with Avatar: TLA as an exception)

Basically as -viewers-, we kind of suck sometimes when it comes to female characters. (This is why we can't have nice things! :o :roll: ) . A male character is more likely to make bigger bucks than a female character. Easier to 'get right' mor 'fit' (apparently) too for whichever writer of any gender as mentioned. I find that too actually. I don't know WHY, I just do. And last time I checked, I was female.

-Checks again-

Yup, still female.

I wouldn't say Pixar was 'sexist' at all myself, no more than any other studio and they don't show it much. Could they do with more female characters? Of course. But I don't somehow see Pixar as evil misogynists who want to brainwash the kiddies into hating/forgetting/pigeonholing the women and keeping them in the sink 'where they belong'. :lol: . They also have many stereotypes which can bug me (a lot sometimes) but not in the female area so much it seems to me, they actually have a fairly diverse female cast as I see it.

Oh and let's not hurl insults please as I've seen above in earlier posts directed at people who called Pixar sexist. Honestly there is a reason why the Pixar fandom has a pretty bad reputation. If someone is mistaken just... don't act like that to them and inform them as to why they are 'wrong'...( you know with actual evidence and with actual discussion). I know I've thrown my own amount of 'wank' before in fandoms before but I'm just in no mood for it really now.
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Postby Evil_Genius_27 » Sat Jun 19, 2010 4:04 pm

I don't really care that they haven't had any female leads, because the leads they do have are realistic and full of heart. The females in Pixar movies are strong, fleshed-out characters, even if they aren't the main focus of the story. EVE, Helen Parr, Dot, Collette, Ellie, Jessie, the list goes on.

I would like to see the geniuses at Pixar tried their hand at a female lead for once, however.
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Postby IncredigirlVirginia » Sat Jun 19, 2010 4:10 pm

I don't think it's a bad idea, it's just bad marketing. That, and I don't see what the big deal is. These are the types of movies you take your family to. There are plenty of girls who like Woody and Sulley and Lightening. However, it is awkward for a lot of guys to watch a female-oriented film. Plus, it becomes easy top call them Feminist in that case(a term my dad often employs to Beauty and the Beast and Princess and the Frog, though I just don't see it.) Either way, I don't see what the big deal is. I like male leads just fine, and I'm willing to wait for Brave, and even longer if they trash the idea.
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Postby K9Girl » Sat Jun 19, 2010 5:02 pm

Isn't the main character of Brave a female???
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Postby IncredigirlVirginia » Sat Jun 19, 2010 5:05 pm

Yes, as is the director. That's why I said I can wait.
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Postby khstar » Thu Jun 24, 2010 6:51 am

I don't think Pixar intends it to be that way. I love the movies and i don't tend to think about "hey how come her name wasn't the title?" heh i mean Eve was very Strong and she saved Wall-e over all. I don't think its about whos the main character and all that; its about how we view it. Wall-e was about love, loneliness, and the world gone to waste. Not about which gender is better heh.
In Toy Story 2 they talked about how they were so glad to have Joan there because it helped the story immensely. I think people just get worked up about things sometimes but we all do.
I'm a girl and I've been a sort of tomboy from the start. I was a country bumpkin so its just how i was raised. Even though it takes a lot of effort to wear pink or something really girly like that, i still have this love for dolls. In fact i so love Barbie. Yet when i went to school one day with a shirt that had a Barbie on it people freaked out and ridiculed me for "liking Barbie" Our society is all a bit bunched and screwed up, but hey whatcha ganna do?
I say don't take things that you love already to extremes. We all love Pixar here so i doubt anyone Truly Truly cares about who had the lead role. At the end of the movie we all always smile and say whether out loud or in our heads, "That was a good movie."
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