In my religion (Christian Science… to learn more, please visit spirituality.com) we are taught how to heal like Jesus did: through pure genuine acceptance and kindness. Through these teachings, we have evidenced thousand of healings because of faith in our religion. This is the evidence I speak of. Please visit spirituality.com to lean more, not to be a salesman for Christian Science, but please visit if you have questions. I am now done with this thread.
Fett101: Then, if you put it that way, scientists sometimes display error in their theories, and so does biblical literalists. They are not… erm, as you put it, “held down,” in any manner; they are just strong in their beliefs.
As Al-Bob put it, there are some bible literalists whose beliefs control them instead of the opposite, but not all bible literalists put one explanation to explain the bible and set it in stone. Your idea of “bible literalists” who are as stubborn as that are, no offense, but they are called the “Catholics.”
Sorry, but it’s a sorry fact that many Catholic literalists set their so-called beliefs of the way of God in stone, especially so in the past, but that’s a topic better left for another thread.
Gay people-yes tormented souls in need of a light
Against abortion-If the wife is in jepoerdy then it is the couple decision about who’s life is more important. For rapes…its part of a plan just have the child…it will lead to something.
For fema;es in office i’m rather vague-i would say yes if she was in my viewpoints (i guess the bible doesn’t say anything against leadership just against preachers or leaders of church being women. It does say wives sbmit to your husbands but other then that i guess a women could be the leader of a nation. In fact now that i think of it God used a women to lead Isreal once in the OT.
I don’t totally reject evolution (don’t make assumptions)
I believe in micro-evolution but i totally disagree with all the facts for macro-evolution. Do i hate evolution…no
I’m not rigid…i’m very open minded to the things that ponder the brain. I do try to evade certain topics that have no biblical meaning. I guess i am rigid on certain points such as the coming of Christ and what he did. I believe that evolution in the fact that we are all from apes and 2 cells (where on earth those came from i’ll never know) is wrong.
Open-minded people are ones who will just listen…if the person doesn’t even listen to your argument they are close minded. If they don’t respond becuase they have nothing to say they are purely open-minded becuase they want to say something but have nothing.
Nice post about Catholics Wboon…quite accurate i must say…
Rachel: I don’t think A113 is really responding the right way, so let me try. There are many different translations of the bible. For example, there is the NIV and the King James version. Each version is translated differently. God’s message is assumably the same, he has one clear, crisp message, virtue, and law all written in his book. The confusion comes from the translation, so it isn’t God’s fault.
Example: A 10 Commandment example. One version would say Thou Shall Not Kill. (meaning killing in general people is a sin). Another version might say Thou Shall Not Murder (meaning accidental and punishment death is okay, but not murder)
I tried. I have been a Christian for nearly 10 years. I can try to answer questions instead of avoiding them or replying with insignificant rhetorical questions.
That most certainly is not accurate about Catholics! I know many catholics are they are more open minded than Christian fundies. The Catholic church have even gone so far as to accept evolution to a degree.
[Source]
A113: Do not say that they are the Catholic Church and they are wrong without any factual or logical based answers to back up your statements. AND DO NOT DODGE THE QUESTION!
Al-Bob: I have quite a few gay friends, and they most certainly not tormented souls in need of a light, and would be offended to hear such outlandish and outdated claims. Some might go so far as to call you a bigot! How anyone could hold such an opinion today astounds me. You might as well say that Islamists and Hindus are also tormented souls and in need of a light.
Might I also say those viewpoints you expressed there are completely outdated and its these kinds of views that oppressed the minorities for so long.
This appears as if you absolutely have no clue whatsoever! You are just dodging everyones questions because you don’t know. If you don’t know, JUST SAY SO! How the heck can we believe you if you don’t try and explain it to us? This crap about never being born is a load of cods wallop. Don’t be daft. Just explain and answer Rachel’s and my questions.
Your behavior is despicable.
A113: Can you also tell me the name of your local library, or the library that you are a member of, as I’d like to contact. You aren’t giving away any personal information or risking doing so by telling me. Send it to me in a PM if you like.
So much for not insulting anyone, then. 
Having been raised by and among catholics, that’s amusing.
What would you call the religious denomination you follow? What is the difference between a catholic literalist and any other. If you don’t believe the bible word for word then what is that? Do you pick and choose what passages to follow? By what authority do you pick passages then?
Actually, I barely read the bible at all - I’m just that lazy.
Alright, maybe I was a little too harsh on the Catholics, and maybe that was based more on my opinions than factual truths (the last thing we want is a Protestant-Catholic conflict happening here). Nevertheless, in general terms, ‘we’ don’t devote our entire lives to a single book, following everything it says, doing everything it claims to be righteous. Sure, every word in may be right and holy - I don’t know, I’m not a very pious Christian. But I would know that an average Christian (I am close to many Christian friends) wouldn’t be programmed by a bible as to his daily actions. Reading a bible doesn’t turn you into some sort of robotic freak that requires a command from the bible to do things. We are still humans, after all, and we, the normal Christian humans, would follow our conscience, in the end - or as some known it as the “Holy Spirits.”
If we see a woman being forced into sexual activities in front of us, regardless of what the Bible says, do you think we would just stand by and watch like heartless beings?!
This is utterly outrageous, I say! 
Wboon: If it is against her will, what I would do is call the police or at least help her. I can’t stand it when some person is being sexually abused, or abused in general. What I learned about the bible is to do the right thing, to stick to my gut.
Morale principle over anything…if you feel it is wrong stop it.
Here is a story of how bad the world has become…
In Arizona people (especially elders) carry home groceries in the spring. Well one day a old man was carrying home his groceries. As he was crossing the street (legally) he was hit by a driver. His body was thrown yards away from the street but the driver only drove away leaving the dying man to himself. Worse still people who walked by started to steal the poor dying man’s groceries. I believe the man died later that afternoon.
How about that??? 
It really show how sickening this world is to me!
We “care” so much but don’t care at all.
that is for people who have NO values at all.
but most people DO have values and christians are not only the good people on the earth.
Watch or read the transcript of this video:
Transcript
By watching this short video, you will be able to prove to yourself that the Bible is repulsive. The Bible is so repulsive that it has no place in a modern, civilized society.
Example 1
The vast majority of Americans believe that God exists, that Jesus is his son, and that God himself gave us the Bible and the Ten Commandments. In fact, Supreme court Justice Antonin Scalia has said that “Ninety-nine percent of Americans believe in the ten commandments.” He has also said, “What the commandments stand for is the direction of human affairs by God.”
If 99% of Americans believe in the ten commandments, how can the Bible be repulsive? Let’s take the fourth commandment as an example. It says:
Remember the sabbath day, and keep it holy. For six days you shall labour and do all your work. But the seventh day is a sabbath to the Lord your God; you shall not do any work—you, your son or your daughter, your male or female slave, your livestock, or the alien resident in your towns. [Exodus 20: 8-9]
This, supposedly, is the word of God, the almighty ruler of the universe.
Now think about this. Wal-mart is open on the Sabbath. And so is Target. Best buy is open on the Sabbath. And so is Circuit City. Home Depot is open on the Sabbath. And so is Lowes. In fact, millions of businesses in America have employees working on the Sabbath. Even Christian Family Bookstores has employees working on the Sabbath.
What should we do with all of these people who are breaking the fourth commandment?
In the Bible’s book of exodus - the same book that contains the ten commandments – the Bible tells us what to do with everyone who breaks the fourth commandment. Exodus 31 verse 15 tells us exactly what to do:
For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day is a Sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD. Whoever does any work on the Sabbath day must be put to death.
That’s right. The Bible commands the death penalty for anyone who works on the Sabbath, and we should obey. Right? This means we have to kill tens of millions of Americans.
Should we line these tens of millions of Americans up and shoot them?
Should we put them in giant gas chambers?
I think we can all agree that the thought of killing millions of innocent Americans is repulsive. A book this repulsive has no place in our society.
And make no mistake about it - the bible really means what it says. It fully intends to be repulsive. In Isaiah 40 verse 8 the Bible says:
The grass withers, the flower fades; but the word of our God will stand for ever. [Isaiah 40 verse 8]
The Bible says the same thing in 1 Peter 1 verses 24 and 25. And in Psalm 19:7 the Bible says:
The law of the Lord is perfect.
Since the laws of the Bible are perfect, they should never change.
And then there is this. In Matthew 5 verse 20 Jesus says:
For I tell you that unless your righteousness surpasses that of the Pharisees and the teachers of the law, you will certainly not enter the kingdom of heaven. - Matthew 5:20
According to Jesus, we must follow the laws of the Bible.
Do you believe that we should kill millions of innocent people because they work on the Sabbath? If not, do you want a book this repulsive to be quoted in public? Read to children? Used in our courts of law?
Example 2
The Bible wants us to kill most people in America. For example, the first commandment says, “Thou shalt have no other Gods before me.” What are we supposed to do with everyone who doesn’t believe in God? We are supposed to Kill them. Deuteronomy chapter 17 says that we are supposed to stone non-believers to death.
If a man or woman living among you in one of the towns the LORD gives you is found doing evil in the eyes of the LORD your God in violation of his covenant, and contrary to my command has worshiped other gods, bowing down to them or to the sun or the moon or the stars of the sky… Take the man or woman who has done this evil deed to your city gate and stone that person to death. – Deut 17:2-7
In 2 Chronicles 15:12-13:
They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord, the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. - 2 Chron 15:12-13
Deuteronomy 13:13-19:
Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases…you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God.
Deuteronomy 13:7-12:
If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods …do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. - Deut 13:7-12
What if you take the name of the lord in vain? Leviticus chapter 24 verse 16 says:
Anyone who blasphemes the name of the LORD must be put to death. The entire assembly must stone him. – Lev 24:16
The Bible is quite clear. We must kill everyone who does not believe in God. There are approximately 30 million people in America who do not believe in any God. There are tens of million more who believe in gods other than the God of the Bible. The Bible commands that we kill them all.
And keep in mind that the word of the Lord lasts forever, and the law of the lord is perfect.
Think of this as a Christian Jihad. The idea of killing tens of millions of people because they don’t believe in God is repulsive.
Example 3
If you curse your father and mother you are to be killed:
All who curse their father or mother must be put to death. - Leviticus 20:9
Example 4
If you commit adultery you are to be killed:
If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife - with the wife of his neighbor - both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death. - Leviticus 20:10
Example 5
If you happen to be homosexual you are to be killed.
If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death. - Leviticus 20:13
So let’s review: God commands us to kill:
Everyone who works on the Sabbath
veryone who does not believe in God
Anyone who curses father or mother
Everyone who commits adultery
Everyone who happens to be Homosexual
According to the Bible, we need to kill tens of millions of innocent Americans. The idea of killing this many innocent people is repulsive. The idea that people would walk around carrying a book that demands the death of tens of millions of innocent people is repulsive.
Example 6
Here’s another example of the Bible’s idiocy. Rebellious teenagers should all be killed as well. Here’s what the Bible says in Deuteronomy chapter 21:
If someone has a stubborn and rebellious son who will not obey his father and mother, who does not heed them when they discipline him, then his father and his mother shall … say to the elders of his town, ‘This son of ours is stubborn and rebellious. He will not obey us. He is a glutton and a drunkard.’ Then all the men of the town shall stone him to death. - Deut 21
Think about how many American teenagers need to die.
Example 7
In Matthew 18 verses 7 through 9, Jesus speaks:
If your hand or your foot causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life maimed or crippled than to have two hands or two feet and be thrown into eternal fire. And if your eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to enter life with one eye than to have two eyes and be thrown into the fire of hell. - Matthew 18:7-9
This verse is repulsive on three levels:
It is repulsive because Jesus is such an idiot here. He is completely wrong.
It is repulsive because it demands that people maim themselves.
It is repulsive because the entire concept of “hell” is repulsive.
Jesus is an idiot. Cutting off your hand or gouging out an eye accomplishes nothing. If you are having a problem with unproductive behaviors, what you need to do is talk with a counselor or see a therapist. Self-amputation is absurd and repulsive. Jesus dispenses advice that is completely useless, and recklessly dangerous as well.
Example 8
The Bible’s absolute sexism is well known, and it is repulsive. Here are two examples:
Women should remain silent in the churches. They are not allowed to speak, but must be in submission, as the Law says. If they want to inquire about something, they should ask their own husbands at home; for it is disgraceful for a woman to speak in the church. - 1 Corinthians 14
And:
Let a woman learn in silence with all submissiveness. I permit no woman to teach or to have authority over men; she is to keep silent. - 1 Tim 2
We can find dozens of verses that are just as sexist. The Bible’s sexism is both ridiculous and repulsive.
Example 9
The Bible fully supports slavery. In fact, the Bible has been used in many cases, including the American civil war, as an authoritative justification of slavery. Here are three examples.
Your male and female slaves are to come from the nations around you; from them you may buy slaves. You may also buy some of the temporary residents living among you and members of their clans born in your country, and they will become your property. You can will them to your children as inherited property and can make them slaves for life. - Leviticus 25:44
Also:
If a man beats his male or female slave with a rod and the slave dies as a direct result, he must be punished, but he is not to be punished if the slave gets up after a day or two, since the slave is his property. - Exodus Chapter 21:20
Also:
Bid slaves to be submissive to their masters and to give satisfaction in every respect; they are not to be refractory, nor to pilfer, but to show entire and true fidelity. - Titus 2:9
You can see that, according to the Bible:
Buying and selling slaves is fine.
Beating slaves is fine.
Slaves are to show entire and true fidelity.
If you are an intelligent person, you know that he entire idea of slavery is repulsive.
Example 10
The Bible is riddled with repulsion. Take, for example, this verse:
Anyone who is captured will be run through with a sword. Their little children will be dashed to death right before their eyes. - Isaiah 13
Or this:
Samaria shall bear her guilt, because she has rebelled against her God; they shall fall by the sword, their little ones shall be dashed in pieces, and their pregnant women ripped open. - Hosea 13
Or this:
Now therefore, kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman who has known man by lying with him. But all the young girls who have not known man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves. - Numbers 31
You get the picture. The Bible is repulsive.
You have seen ten graphic examples of repulsion in this short video. You can find hundreds of verses like these throughout the old and new testaments. You find Racism, sexism and bigotry gallore. The deaths millions of innocents are chronicled in page after page of this appalling book. There is no question that this book is repulsive. It has no place in a modern, civilized nation.
We currently use the Bible throughout American society. We do that, in large part, because most Americans have never read the bible and have no idea how disgusting it is.
We read from this book at weddings and funerals.
We force people to put their hands on this book in court.
We find copies of the Bible in nearly every hotel room in America.
The Bible demands that we kill everyone who works on the Sabbath. The Bible commands us to kill teenagers who drink too much. The Bible empowers us to enslave people of other nations. The Bible commands that we oppress women and kill people who happen to be homosexual.
A book this repulsive has no place in our society. It is time for the intelligent, thoughtful people of this nation to acknowledge this simple fact and act on it.
A113 and Al-bob - As we have told you a thousand times, the Creationism theory and the “theory” of evolution are NOT of the same standing! When will are going to actually read what we are saying and digest it? The theory of relativity is still a theory, but do we stop that from being taught? No. But, by the same token, if new information comes along that throws part or all of a theory out the window, the thing about science, is that it doesn’t have a hidden agenda like religion does so it will be happy to modify the theory to accommodate for the new data. The thing about intelligent design, is that it came up with the answer first, then modelled the equation to suit the answer. (Even though it’s been proven that the answer is wrong/very unlikely anyway.)
A113 please answer my questions on Conservapedia and whether your local library has any books about the basics of evolution.
I can’t believe there are people like you still living in the 21st century… Just goes to show that Christianity can sometimes be the most least accepting of groups, unless you totally conform, that is. And it’s kind of ironic that for such a “loving” religion such as Christianity, they are so Hell-bent on denying minorities such as homosexuals the right to marry another consenting adult (who happens to be of the same gender) and adopt kids (who are in desperate need of a home.)
Why does God make gay people, then? There are many gay people who live fulfilling and happy lives, and one of the only problems to do with their happiness would be un-accepting people such as yourself that make them unhappy, or uncomfortable in their own skin. I’ve already covered this topic in the “Palin” thread, but if you want me to reiterate what I said, I will. Just out of interest… how do you feel about transgendered people? Are they tormented, too? If God doesn’t make mistakes, why would he give someone a female brain but male body, for example?
But then you aren’t being open-minded. The Bible was written less than 2000 years ago when issues that are relevant today, weren’t known, or written about, and because it wasn’t written in the Bible, you try not to think about it?
While I sympathise with that story, there are also many good things that happen in this world that don’t get shown on the news. Also, why did God let that happen, couldn’t he have controlled some part of that situation so the old man wasn’t hurt, or so it didn’t happen at all?
I’m sorry, I don’t see the point of that paragraph, except for that you are impying that athiestist don’t feel they have a purpose. Firstly, you can’t assume that because you are relgious, and you feel that religion gives you a purpose, that by the opposite end of the spectrum athiests do not have a religion, therefore they don’t feel that they have a purpose.
Personally, I’m not into organised religion, but I feel I do have a purpose in this life: to be happy, to learn and expand my mind, to be kind to others and connect and love other people, to fight against injustice and ignorance, to reproduce and have children to pass on my knowledge to them… And that’s just off the top of my head.
But if the Bible is the word of God, then why does God let mistakes creep in? Or why didn’t he make a rule stating that it not be translated because of the chance of human error. You’d be surprised at how one single word in the Bible, one mistranslation can affect Christians’ actions, or justify morally wrong actions.
So, basically, depending on which actions you want to justify, you just find whichever Bible has the translation that best suits you. And the “though shalt not kill” could be taken literally to mean anyone or anything, even animals.
Thank you. I appreciate that.
gay people are sometimes the most caring and tolerant! They don’t brag, they don’t care about how soemone looks or what religion they are, and are very friendly. Unfortunely, I can’t say the same for some christians.
WALL-E: If you be any caring or tolerant at all, you would refrain from speaking ill of Christians just because of your personal feud with one. I do know of many other Christians that are truly good and a few, saintly. If you be mature enough, you should not be blinded by stubbornness and see this.
B-o-T, everyone.
Back on topic? We are on topic. I am fine with christians, heck, I live near a church! But nevertheless, when christians/muslims/anyone says that because of their way of life they are tormented or in soem way evil that gets my goat.
For the past few pages, the topic of Evolution and Creationism and their belief system had been entirely turned into the good and bad points of Christians and other miscellaneous religious groups.
Now, can we please get back on topic? 
Thank you.
Thanks Wboon…sometimes its hard to keep up with all of the replies.
Walle-
on the Ten Commandments; Yes it is a shame how culture today and the need for customers has driven to such lengths. I’m a strong believer in rest on Sunday and companies that do work on sunday should change their standards.
Line up and shoot-I don’t think that shooting people would be a work of Christ. The OT does put bold guidelines on the law but Jesus rewrote the laws and made the ten into two.
Love the Lord your God with all your mind, soul, and heart.
And love your neighbor as youself.
I don’t think any of these ersemble killing osmeone if they don’t obey the sabbath.
I agree with WBoon. We’ve gotten extremely off-topic.
Back to evolution/creation, everyone. For any questions i’ve left unanswered, please PM me.
B-on-T:
Give me one proof.
The Grand Canyon, okay? How did the Colorado River flow uphill? Try to explain it in one sentence of any length. 
Rachel:
I’ll answer this the best I could. I believe that the reason why God would let his word be translated is to spread his religion all over the globe. If I remember correctly, according to the bible, God wanted to preach the gospel all over the world, and make himself known to everyone. In a sense, he wanted to make his christian family grow. Now I know that a one-word-mistranslation can go a long way. I think the mistranslation come down to human error. Some translators might agree that one word might be “this”, while other translators might agree that one wor might be “that”
Well, I just learned what I learned in church. I don’t go looking up bibles and find which translation suits me best. When it come to the “kill” part, I learned that killing people is a sin, but sometimes, in order to do the right thing, killing must be done. For example, if my friend is being threatened and I have a gun in my hand, I would not hesitate to pull the trigger to save my friend’s life if I had no other choice.
I tried rachel. I am not defending anyone or anything. I am just answering your questions to the best of my knowledge. Please don’t stone me. 
Example 2- you will never see a Christian Jihad…which means that not a lot of people want to kill people becuase they have different religions.
We don’t kill people like muslums do when they aren’t the same religion.
Example 3-If you curse your mother and father you should be worthy of reproach. Another OT reference…NT is much better in my opinion.
All of your posts are old testiment…i will not respond to the original unbearable law of the OT…even God realized that the people coulnd’t keep all of the laws.
To cut foot off- Example 7-yes if you have truoble looking at bad stuff close your eyes. They don’t mean literally though you could do that…they mean get rid of whatever makes you fall…just get rid of it. T.V., internet, friends…anything.
Yes women are not allowed to lead churches becuase the bible says so…Men are the only ones allowed to lead church congregations.
More OT…
I’m not suer we force people…i’m pretty sure that the bible is the standard on many items such as devotion for the couple getting married…to honor the country by uising principle from the bible…NOT cheat…not lie…not murder…stuff like that. The bible is the standard for morality. We use it becuase it is the absolute example.