That’s true…if it gets too close…it will look like a more sofisticated Syndrome.
If I could choose, maybe some madman who had a very strange childhood, who grows up loving crime. Instead oof robbing banks to get rich, he does it for pure enjoyment. Instead of kidnaping someone, he would rather enjoy the look of terror on their faces. (Maybe it sounds too much like the Joker)
Yes, unfortunately, the moment I read your description of the villain, Joker came to my mind. 
How about this. We could have that “menacing, absolutely frightening mental nut” you yearned to place in the story before to be the real threat of the sequel, and maybe this mysterious thief could be a minor villain who is not a real villain at all.
Maybe his intention for doing what he does is because he wants to get connected to the world of crime to research something; maybe his parents’ death, or maybe a stolen priceless treasure of his family. That way, we could have much deeper story lines and a sinister villain all in one package.
So? What do you think? 
It sounds very intriguing. It really got me thinking the possibilities Mr. Dragon. Would you like to expand on that idea a bit? And what would this even more sinister villain be like? Would the minor villain you speak of have any powers? Would the other villain have powers?
lol Mr Dragon. Oh, phish posh! XD
Well, Mr Swordsman ( ), by the ‘incredibly menacing nutcase,’ I was referring to the villain you wanted to ‘really scare the children out of their seats’ yesterday. I am not exactly sure what is your level of ‘terror,’ but I am certain that you could work on that part while I work on the minor villain.
The minor villain - the jewel thief I was discussing about earlier - as I said, does not need to have any superpowers at all to add that insulting effect as to why the Supers were not able to capture him, despite their incredible abilities. He could be considered as the ‘bad guy’ at first,charm Violet Parr unintentionally and thus, getting the Parrs intertwined with the villain in terms of romantic affairs, which is not very beneficial on Bob and Helen’s part. Then, near the middle of the story, your ‘incredibly evil’ villain could be revealed by this thief to be the real culprit of all the evil doing occurring around the city.
By then, we could craft a really twisted plan for this evil villain to carry out, one that unfortunately involves the deaths of some important people, I am sure. But, by discussing about that, we are getting ahead of ourselves.
You guys have really moved since i last was on.
I came up with something last night but now it looks too big and extravagent for what we seem to be coming up with. Here is what i got;
Our villian starts out small…like any other theif. But this guy has a special job. Instead of doing the robbery he “plans” the robbery and even helps make scenarios that allow his “gang” to do big things. His job is to plan all of their movements and strategy. One year later his group has grown into this state-wide ring of members who take their orders from him due to his brilliant planning. He then leaves the scene and while still working with the gang through a blog…he now begins to build an underwater facility that will house his greatest scheme ever. What his scheme calls for is a global ring of theives. He will lead them from his headquarters as they will help the world through sabatages and robberies. They will shape the world and control certain economies and happenings. This will allow them to basically control the world.
If anyone including the FBI attempt to break down the gang our villian has already outsmarted them. At each level he has positioned a spy and a missinglink so that the only information one can get is up to his leader and his leader only. He has set the system up so that only certain leaders know who he is and they wouldn’t tell a soul. He also has the system set up so that anyone who leaves will be told on and the police will come and take them away. So you have to stay once you get in…he also gets rid of people who don’t support him or want to start their own gang from his. He is sorta like Stallin.
We find our villian holding an international meeting at his underwater base beneath the Atlantic Ocean…he has with him council members from all of the world. They talk about the economies of the world and how easily they could be broken. They plan and they take action…
lol The only item you had missed was the addition of the ‘frightening villain’ TSS wanted, nothing more. 
I like your plot, Al-Bob, but seriously… what is with the obsession with blogs? I could not really imagine a serious criminal contacting his minions through a socializing network that was designed for emos to rant out their daily annoyances. What does he use? Blogger or MySpace? 
See the cheesiness in this? No offense, Al-Bob; I like the most of your idea, so let me continue…
For this villain to start out small is a little time-consuming, IMO. I mean, once the movie begins, the audience would expect to see the Parrs in one time period, not jumping all over several of them (time periods). So, if we introduce this minor villain at the start, then later on, jumping into a year later… As you could see, it is rather complex and, in my most humble view, rather unnecessary when we could just straight away introduce this thief as who we wanted him to be; a widely known cunning thief under a tremendous amount of the public spotlight.
Despite that, I like how you have him as a cunning mastermind who plans out the criminals’ various heists. Though I would have the thief working solo to increase his ‘coolness,’ I am sure a proper group could we fitted in as well.
I think this is more fitting for the major villain; the one that will ‘frighten children out of their seats.’ For the minor villain of superb charisma, let us make him going solo, maybe having a secretary in his underwater base or something. That would probably have him appear much cooler, and thus explain why the people love him so much.
Oh, and he has to have a really cool name, so that fangirls could yell it out fanatically. “I LOVE YOU [insert name] 4EVER!”
For all the world domination, crime ring, manipulation of the members involved, the systematic leaders, and the international meeting, we could apply that to the real villain of the story. Remember, this thief just looks like a villain, but is actually doing what he does for a proper reason we audience could respect.
I also have been thinking about adding superpowers to either of these villains. I think teleportation is great for the thief to explain his amazing escapes from the Police.
I really love the ‘international’ part of your idea, though. We could have this crime syndicate as something similar to Quantum from Bond 22, having members from China, India, Europe, Australia, the US of course, and the rest of the world. It would make this organization look like a really powerful gang of criminals. But of course, its motivation would have to fitted with a little more originality than ‘economy control,’ something we have seen in many films under the ‘action’ genre already. Something more sinister.
Maybe they want to conquer the world to be deities. Maybe they have some sort of human, non-Super technology that would, as you said, ‘shape the world.’ What if that is put in a more literal sense? What if they have access to time-traveling technology that lets them shape history to their will? That would be a frightening villain I would not want to be pitched against.
Worse, what if they are able to shape reality? Maybe they could eliminate the force of gravity from Earth. To simply put it, what if they decide to play god?
Of course, certain deep story lines have to be included. If it is a criminal organization wanting to play god out of mere humor and amusement, I would not really want to work on that. Maybe we could have them possessing a certain philosophy of life, treating it as impure and needing alterations. That would be a good reason for them to play god.
As I have mentioned before I really love underwater layers. Really secretive and mysterious too. Kinda adds more intensity to the movie if something breaks, causing a flodding.
Anyways, I would like the villain to have a “world domination” motivation, but I think that gets really overused. How about a Super Villain who wants to not rule the world, but destroy the world, and its inhabitants. The remaining survivors, the main villain, and his army will take over the decimated world over and replace the world’s nations into one monarch rule? Just a theory.
For the “minor villain”', how about after realizing how much evil he has done to the world (and the Incredibles), he switches sides. However, at the climatic moment, he sacrifices himself to save everyone.
You are referring to an apocalyptic story line. I don’t think The Incredibles, or even a sequel to it, is ready for a chaotic, end-of-the-world feel yet. That is beginning to be overused, too. But, it is original, because no real literature actually have the hero losing the battle, and then the villain actually conquering the world as he have planned to. So, sure, we could work this in, but we need to make sure it lasts a long time rather than a short moment before the heroes expectantly win again. This would then leave the atmosphere that evil had actually triumph over good, and yet we could still keep a deep story than is not just about evil dominating the world.
And no, no. The minor villain has to be good all the time to gain that respect. If we learned that he was actually a thug like he had seemed to be, not only is it kinda disappointing to the fans (among the movie audience) that had actually liked this guy during the first hour (presuming that the realization of his alignment is within that time), it really eliminates any deep back story we could had fitted into him, making him just a minor-minor character no one would ever care about several years after the sequel has passed.
Besides, him sacrificing himself after realizing his evil doing kinda reminds me of the much more cheesy Mr. Freeze from the failed Batman And Robin movie. Why did he not realize it before? It just seems kinda it was scheduled, like someone told him, “Okay, you need to realize you are evil at this time and this scene. Don’t ask why, just do it.” It just really make him a shallow character and what I am trying to go for here is that every character should bring some significance into view rather than just stand by one side and let others, particularly the main characters, shine under the spotlight. So I think your suggestion about the minor villain really could not be worked out, sorry.
We could add that intensifying flooding scene, however. I actually pictured this scene where the thief confesses as to why he does the things he do (for a very acceptable reason rather than one we would find to be ridiculous) to the Parrs, and then maybe they (the Parrs) understood, felt for him emotionally, and then the water starts to surge in.
But, we must make sure that it did not just pour in spontaneously without a reason. We could relate the major crime organization villain to the flooding, maybe having it sabotage the glass walls around the lair or something.
Again, the major villain has to be intimidating, so nothing cheesy like they set it up so that they are able to escape after the water pours in. We really have to make sure their plan is extremely effective, thus bringing the possibility for the Parrs (and the thief) to really meet the fate of dying to the maximum leverage we are able to reach.
With all that, I want to learn more about your idea of the monarch rule. What we would need to considerate is how the Supers would react to this. Since they had let down the citizens, would the government turn on them or something. Maybe we could even set up Frozone to react strongly to their defeat. All that stuff.
Overall, I think it would be too much for one movie, so maybe we could cast the major villain’s domination into the next sequel, while this one, we just focuses on the thief and relatable issues of life the Parrs have to go through. I would really love to see The Incredibles under a humane story line rather than just more action sequences that would only serve to numb our minds. Yeah, that is my two-cents on that.
About the world ending up in oblivion, that is just a theory. I don’t expect it to happen. I am just saying that it could be a plan of the villian’s. After capturing the Incredibles, he can monolouge his plan to them about destroying the world and starting over anew… I understand that if it actually happened, then the movie would be really dark for a PG rating.
I don’t think the minor villain has to be good all of the time. But he has to have a struggle with good and evil for people to feel compassionate for him. He, because of his stronger and more powerful boss, he is reluctant to join the other side, but after one point that really impacts him (maybe Violet nearly dies because of him, or realizing the horror he brings to the city), he finally decides (as Obama says) that it is time for a change.
About the flooding scene, I think we can start it the intensity by giving the Incredibles no way out of the flooding base. The minor villain gives them one last hope of escaping, but must stay behind and perish in order for it to work. Maybe the Parrs could make their way toward the topedo launcher of the base, and the minor villain can only activate it from another room, not enough time to save himself.
Let me ask a question. Would any one here want to see a pretty solid fight scene? one-on one? Maybe we could set up something like this. Violet and the minor villain (who many of you suggest that Violet befriends beforehand) end up fighting each other. The mino villain fights her because of a direct order from the main villain. Violet fight him for two reasons: to defend herself, and to stall (for the when the other Incredibles go on without her to confront the major villain).
Anyways, if this would happen, wouldn’t you think that Brad Bird might be a little against Violet engaging in any hand-tohand combat? Chances are, she will get hit and hurt in this fight. But it follows his idea that the bad guys are merciless, that they aren’t the ones on TV (where a bad guy goes easy on a girl).
Anyways, I bet I can expand a little on a one-on-one fight scene, but for now, I’ll stop.
Yes, I would agree that to have people feeling compassionate about this guy, he has to have a certain struggle of some sort, but that does not necessary have to be between good and evil. It could be something else with a deeper meaning.
Everytime in a Pixar feature, we always only get two alignments; justice and otherwise, nothing really in between. This time, we should add in a much complex story line into view, something that would not deprive this character of the ‘respect’ the audience should have on him.
If I am a Violet fan, and I knew that she almost died because of this jerk, I would never like him at all, which defeats the purpose. If this guy did anything horrible and inhumane, I would just treat him as another villain. He suddenly aligning towards good would just feel ridiculous to me (as a general audience member not knowing any better about a possible good story, not as a writer with a sense of what good plot lines are like). Like, you have did all these bad things, and now you are suddenly wanting to change? So what if you sacrificed your life for the heroes? The damage you have dealt is still there.
So, it really creates this unnecessary atmosphere around this guy when he was supposed to be likened by the movie audience. I am sorry that I continuously contradicts your viewpoints, The Star Swordsman, seemingly wanting to do what I like, but I just do not feel that degrading the villain to a horrific man really makes the story any more unique than the other Pixar features, which, as I stated, only includes good and evil.
Also, I would really love more emotions for Violet this time. I actually came up with something for the minor villain to take up. Tell me what you think of it. Treat this like one of Mark Andrews’ story boarding session.
As we know, Syndrome aligned himself to evil after assuming that the hero he had always admired was just an egoistical celebrity who treats people not any better than dirt, which we know was totally untrue. But anyway, after his brutal death, I want Syndrome to be tied in one more time; indirectly, that is. How about having this minor villain… We shall call him ‘Kid,’ since he is about the age of Violet Parr.
So, how about having Kid be relate by blood to Buddy Pine? If the audience learned that in the middle of the story, they would automatically assume that Kid is seeking revenge against Bob Parr. But, it is nothing like that, in actuality. Syndrome, during the period in which he was still scheming his master plan to get back at Incredible, he fooled around with alcohol, money, and most importantly, women, living his own ‘glory life’ as it is.
Because of so, naturally, it could be understandable how Buddy came to be a father at such a young age. He cruelly abandoned his child (not even desiring to ‘train him into becoming evil like him’ because it was not the child of Bob Parr) and his wife, treating them like dirt as Mr. I once did; his manner of retaliating at life. His son, merely an infant at that time, barely had the consciousness to chew solid food, less remember that fateful incident.
So, after some years have passed, Kid has grown to be a teenager like Violet. His mother have committed suicide upon his father’s departure due to not having the mentality to handle the pressure of being treated like an item of pleasure, so has been an orphan ever since his babyhood.
But, his take on the life of crime was not for the riches, gold, or even the jewels he had stolen (and returned after a period of a week or so). He knew how his father died; he had heard it over the news. As inhumane as Syndrome was, he was still, after all, his father.
Now, we could not make it easy for him just to reach Mr. Incredible (whose identity Kid knows not much about other than the blond hair and plumb physique) and question about his father’s death, or there would not be a story. So, what we could do is have Kid approaching Violet in school after maybe learning about her identity someway, but that is only after years of searching for the identities of the ‘Incredibles,’ especially the leader, Mr. Incredible.
If Kid learns that Violet Parr is actually Invisigirl, he would, without a doubt, approach her just to get to her father, but then, along the way, maybe he gained feelings for her and at some point, Violet learns that Kid might have cheated her feelings and that is when Kid makes his confession, telling her that he might have actually fall in love with her throughout this entire ordeal.
Throughout the entire story, some deaths would occur, and Kid would be responsible - for none of them. No. In fact, it was the crime syndicate that had eliminated those people, whether because they were a hindrance to their activities or just to silence them.
And no monologuing. The last thing we want from this criminal is a decrease in the darkness, and monologuing would just do that, in the contrary. They are the perfect criminal (seemingly); they are not going to repeat the mistakes all super villain had for the past millennium or so. Everything they do would be coordinated. Every action they take is carefully planned. Thus, this makes them look like an incredibly well made villain, especially if we add in a touch of deep back story to their leader.
Back to Bob. When Mr. Incredible first learns that Kid is actually the sole child of his greatest enemy, he was naturally wanting to crush him into bits. But then, slowly, as he feels for him (I mean, come on, the kid has his father abandoning him when he was born for a year then having him killed mysteriously by some guy who do not give any concerns about his being at first).
Then we start to piece together the puzzle and learn about the true culprits of the murders, and I just have something really cool I want to test it out. See what you guys think of this.
So, in the first movie, we had Bob under the illusion that his family was dead, including Helen, right? What if the children are in danger this time, and Violet’s life was ‘taken away?’ After learning about the truth to his father, Kid has no reason whatsoever to fight the crime ring, unless the girl that he has owes his life to (yes, Violet died sacrificing herself for him; the irony) is dead. He would not go into this insane rage like most vengeful souls would (maybe Bob and Helen would, though). He would just calmly tell her parents that, “Let me join you… I owe her this one,” leading us to the new sequel with an opened story.
So, as you can see, a lot of intertwining emotions here. Bob feels guilty for causing this whole mess ever since the time he mistreated Buddy, leading to this whole chain of unfortunate events.
Violet got involved with this new battle of her raging feelings, trying to simply choose which boy she wanted to be with (after all, she is just a 15 years old girl; how deep could she be?), and I think Tony fans should not really be disappointed here, so I guess Tony aligning to evil could not be worked out here… But as I said, he is a flirt. And then, after learning that Kid might have been toying with her feelings, she got more things to worry about (only to ironically sacrifice her life out of the love she felt inside her).
Helen and Dashiell should receive the same amount of emotional battles, too. I would picture Dash to be falling in love for the first time as well (and then, it would be Violet’s turn to tease ), but these two characters do not really have much to work with, as any possible story lines that could be suggested would only make them look cliche (as in Helen being the cliched motherly character in all family movies, while Dash is the cliched annoying brother, etc., etc.), so we need to spend some time working on this.
But, aside from that, what do you think of my idea on this, Kid character? Don’t forget to offer your applause after the story board ends.
Dragon: Dang, you really are detailed about this. I like it!
A response to your paragraphs:
I think a struggle between good and evil (helping the Supers or following orders by his superior) is pretty strong. BUt I am intrested on what could be a deeper struggle.
I think this would cause a really emotional moment for the audience. For instance, they might start off hating him because of what he did to Violet or any other of the Parrs. Now that the audience sees that he has a change of heart, and starts helping the good guys, the audience should most likely want to cheer for him. (after he has gained the Incredibles trust of course) In the end, if he is going to sacrifice himself, the audience could feel really sad for the minor villain, for they had really hated him at first but later grown to like and accept him. Do you understand what I mean? I can try reexplaining again if I confused people.
I don’t mind much Buddy. I like hearing it from all different view points. This broadens my look on the Incredibles Universe. By all means, keep sharing your opinions, even counter mine all you want if you wish.
//////////\
Part of me likes your idea of having Kid be related to Buddy Pine. This would provide the excellent motive of revenge. I get this feeling that revenge has been covered by Buddy in the first movie. (Maybe not jealously, but you know what I mean)
I think i see another part where you and I think alike. You see the Kid as an orphan, I see him as a wondering loner with litter or no info about his parents (if he has got any).
So if Kid takes on the life of crime not for wealth, what does he do it for? To emit some of the anger that has brewed in him after his daddy died?
If we’re going to have Kid learning about Violet’s identity, I believe that he should find out somewhere outside of school. (He could probably see a crime happen in the city, and Violet running into a nearby alley. Kid follows, but sees Violet in her super suit running out.) He could tell her that he knows at school, really shocking her and scaring her. Both can go to some place alone at lunch and secretly discuss. (the interactions between them would stir up deeper feeling for each other so when it time comes to part ways, it makes saying good bye so much harder and sadder)
Now after connecting the dots that Invisigirl is the daughter of Mr. I, I like your idea of using her to get to her father. It would absoultely shatter Violet if she finds out that Kid is just using her instead of being her actual friend.
I agree that some events (part of me agrees with death) happen with no indication that Kid is responsible for them. So basicly, the deaths are people that were sent out to stop the main villain?
Monolouging was an option. Of course we don’t want it to take up too much time. But we want the plot to be made clear to the audience.
I don’t think he would want to crush him. But I am sure that he would find out that Violet would be hanging out with him. I bet Bob would display overprotection (typical father/daughter relationship). He would probably pull him aside and tell him not to do anything that would hurt her or his family.
Oh boy, this keeps getting more exciting the farther I read.
I like this idea. Kid switches sides due to someone so near and friendly to him (assuming that Violet is the only friend Kid has) has died. Now the good guys have a drive motivation for revenge, which is kinda ironic in a sense for me. Part of me is against this idea though. I absolutely love Violet and wish that she would at least stay alive. I am sure many fans out there would want her to stay alive as well. I guess if she takes a laser beam at full blast, intended for Kid, that she nearly dies, I think you can get the same drive behind it.
Overall, I like the idea of kid. I agree and disagree with most of your ideas. But remember, this is just debate. No one is right or wrong. I’m just sharing to you what I feel, think, and believe.
Mr. Dragon, if you could do me a favor and tell me what you think of my idea below.
To start, I am honored that my idea has brought you joy. 
Like the title stated, I want this to be the ‘ultimate Incredibles sequel.’
Oh, we could have the audience hate him at the beginning, yet keeping the citizens in the story loving his charming personality. See, the thing I would like to go for at the start of the sequel is to have the people liking a villain instead of the usual heroes, making Helen wonder if risking the lives of her family saving people who only treat them as temporal celebrities was worth it, and because of these emotional dilemmas Kid gave her and the ‘real heroes’ they love, the audience hate him.
But, we have to make sure the citizens do not look like they were hypnotized or something. I mean, which normal person would love an evil villain who has gave the citizens countless torturing episodes? Definitely not a million persons.
Later on, after learning about his tragic past, then we could earn the audience’s love back, too, after learning about the chain reaction Bob had set forth 15 years ago.
I think the only sacrifice that we should keep is that of Violet, because she did it out of love, even after gaining that foul impression Kid set into her with his confession. I think it is definitely stronger than Kid’s sacrifice, because we really gave Kid little reason to sacrifice himself. We could say that he was trying to save Violet, and thus having himself killed, then the Parrs go on and live happily ever after, which, as you could see, if not a very deep story.
Trust me on this one, I am not going to kill any member of the Parrs family, especially Violet Parr. She will reappear again in the second sequel after Kid goes to the ends of the Earth to search for her, thus proving his love. But, we are getting ahead of ourselves on that one.
As to the reason Kid had got himself involved with crime, I have said it before; it was to get connected to the world of crime, where he could approach Mr. Incredible much easier when he confronts him as a villain. After confronting him, he could learn more about his father’s life (his intention was not to kill Mr. Incredible), they move on, and so on and so forth, but instead, he learned of Invisigirl’s true identity, and the rest as they say, is history.
I like the idea about informing her his knowledge at school, though. I think it should happen where Violet is most helpless, where she is most unable to yelp out in terror because if she does, the hundreds of people around her would get curious, one thing leads to another, and more would find out about her little secret. So, I think either the cafeteria or the class would do.
And I am terribly sorry that I have missed that part of your post. I think a one on one battle between Violet and the villain is definitely great, but I think she is not ready for a real battle yet in this sequel. If she battles Kid, he would just dodge her attacks constantly due to his unwillingness to fight her. If we could have the family members attacking each other, i.e.: Helen attacks Violet unwillingly because someone forces her to, etc. Violet would be at the disadvantage her because she would never attack her family.
So unless you are going for an emotional scene here involving Helen realizing how she is willing to attack her daughter but she is not willing to attack her mum, I think we are better off leaving the action sequence for the next sequel, when the real villain is involved. But by then, when it is time for the second sequel, we would have to come up with even better story lines. That is why it is better if we just leave that aside for now.
Dragon:
You are welcome man. If Mr. Bird does catch a glimpse of this, i hope he takes our ideas into consideration.
Remember that our current idea of a Kid/Violet love pair is just an idea. In the end of the Incredibles, we saw Violet asking Tony out for a date, so there could be a possiblity that Violet could still be in love with Tony. If that is the case, Kid might end up being one of Violet’s good friends (maybe after being so alone for his entire life).
I think if Kid scarificed himself, not only for Violet and the Incredibles, but for the world as well, it could be a little bit powerful. He would sarcifice himself for Violet because he cares for her. But he also sacrifices himself to save humanity. Maybe a “either you die or the whole world dies” sorta situation. Just a thought.
Okay, I understand. Thanks for the clearification.
Cafeteria would work, but how about after class where not only her school, but people outside her school could hear as well?
I think that Violet could do fine in a one-on-one combat. Some time wou;d past between her first mission and the sequel. So she must have gone through some form of training. I think if given the chance, she could pull it off. And think about it, a skinny, teenaged Super Hero girl with invisibility and force fields for Super powers. Some bad guys might think that she could be an easy target, but she could prove other wise.
If she does battle Kid, maybe Kid could be the more aggressive fighter between the two because of heavy pressure the main villain would put on him. Think of it like a “You either fight her or you will have to face me.” situation Kid gets put into. Violet could be the unwilling one to fight her because she has grown to trust Kid as a friend, growing this strong bond and relationship between them. Violet would be unwilling to break it, making her more defensive. Kid, who had decided to throw away all of it, would be the aggressor.
Helen attacks Violet huh? Hmm, that sounds intriging. Like she gets hypnotized to do so? I understand that Violet would hate to hurt her family, which could easily explain why she would stay on defense instead of unleashing some attacks.
Here is another question. I have asked this from some people, but do you see Violet getting punched in the face or stomach if she ends up fighting someone really tough? How will she react? Would she just take it or squirm and whimper in pain?
(just a random thought)
Man, this debate is wearing me out. Added with my cold and slight fever, I am not in a very suitable condition to continue this much longer than it has been already, so I shall just review on one of your points before heading to bed.
I would hate to say this, especially to you who seems to be a fan of the Violet/Tony coupling, but Tony Rydinger appeared to me as a rather stereotype character. When I first saw him, I got the feeling that Brad added him as a filler just so that Violet’s dream date came true. We could work on his character if you would like, but it is in my opinion that the villain and heroine relationship is one that would be interesting to exploit, if not giving it a shot.
Being in love with a crush is a very rare occurrence, according to child counselors and expert psychiatrists. Infatuations, really, rather than love. That is why you see some sequels changing the love interest, and even in real life, you see celebrities switching their life-long partner as oftenly as they hire new agents and secretaries due to the hectic lives they live in.
I know Violet is a strong female (or at least we hope she is one), but I have a real hard time imagining Tony to be a really loyal boyfriend of hers. In fact, I am sorry to say that I even have a tough time picturing him as a real person, with the limited two to three minutes of screen time he received.
I think we could only explore several characters in one story. If we have too much characters to exploit, then it would be utterly confusing, that was why I claimed that the crime syndicate is best left for the next sequel. If we focus on one character’s personality, then those of the others would be left out, and so would a good emotional story. But if we are to cram all the characters’ personality in one, it would be too dense, too difficult to be understood.
So, I guess it would be considered biased for me if I am to say that the five members of the Parrs family and one other villain are enough of characters to be explored, altogether having six characters’ personalities. Maybe we could try and fit Tony in the next sequel, but, it is just in my opinion that Brad made a rather shallow character when considering Violet’s soul mate.
Dragon: If you could, I would like for you to extend on my other ideas in my previous post. Get better soon dude.
I had thought about it throughout my sleep, and I felt that there was no need for Tony to be abandoned as a character, despite the little screentime he had.
Here is what I thought of:
Tony have seemed to cheat on Violet through a very vague misunderstanding (we could decide on the content of that later), thus having Violet assuming the worse and leaving him. Of course, the cheating have to be very obvious or her calm and trusting self would not have fallen under that impression.
Then, when Kid comes into play, she gradually begins to like him, too, but yet, in the end, learns that Kid was just using her, to some extent. She did not trust him at first, but even after knowing that Kid might have loved her at some point of time, she refuses to accept him, going on to explain that she have too many insecurities occurring throughout her life, and all she wants to do is to live a peaceful live from then on.
That is when the emotional scene comes in. After Violet explained the part about Tony Rydinger cheating on her, Kid went on to tell her why that is not true (with Kid’s intelligent mind, it is easy to depict that), thus leaving Violet touched, seeing that Kid was willing to prove her ex-boyfriend’s innocence rather than charm her with his charisma. Hence, we have more reason for Violet to fall deeper in love with Kid, but yet, still having feelings for Tony Rydinger.
What do you think?
I like the idea of giving her training, I would give you that. I think at the beginning of the story, we could have the children going through some sort of practice that leave them seem like they are fighting real people, till the end of the training, when the training targets are revealed. While that is happening, we could cut in between those scenes with Helen and Bob actually fighting real criminals, maybe at some point of time, even separately to prove that they are able to fight solo, even though they would rather do so as a family. The Incredi-couple does not have to be separated throughout the entire battle, however, as we just need to give just a few moments to show that they are able to fight alone. Hence, we would get a very exciting opening to the movie, yet fulfilling the purpose of having training initiated.
That is my point. If the main villain has any pressure on him, making him look aggressive, that would eliminate his charm and charisma, something that we would want Violet to oversee.
I think the only time when Kid should ever be pressured to ensure that he is not emotionally invincible is the time when Violet dies. He feels rather guilty that he has used her to some parts, even though he did fall in love with her, and thus, seeks revenge from the main villain… No, ignore that, Kid is too wise for seeking revenge. Seeks to put the main villain behind bars. Yep.
Eeh! In the contrary, Kid would be the unwilling one, because he is calm and cool-headed, and fighting Violet would be the last thing that would gain Violet’s trust. Violet would never trust him because she has learned that he have also betrayed her like Tony did, and also that he is Syndrome’s heir, giving her more reasons for mistrust.
As I said, the reason for confronting Mr. Incredible is just to learn the trust about his father; he has still a lot of hope in his heart, not darkness and grim.
Like she was blackmailed to do so. Hypnotism is way too shallow for a story line. Unless her husband is just inches from an impending death, Helen would never attack her daughter.
Violet, on the other hand, knows that her father is in danger, but still could not help herself to attack Helen, her very own mother.
We could have her in that scenario during the training scene. Maybe one of the training bombs blow up on her. In my opinion, she would remain strong, throw back an angry stare, and stand right back up, continuing on her training.
Here is how I believe Tony can be used in a sequel.
He could still be Violet’s boyfriend. However, he is having trouble staying loyal because Violet keeps canceling dates (due to her Super Work). So this adds another conflict to Violet’s life.
Tony could also break up with her, going to someone he considers more worthy of him. I’m afraid that this idea might revert Violet back into a shy, insecure girl though.
Anyways, I like your idea with Kid. If Violet can’t have Tony, she must move on, and you provide a good suggestion.
I see your point. Maybe deep inside, Violet knows there is good in Kid, and wants to bring it out of him before she gets hurt. Maybe Kid could be a little agressive. He is torn between hurting the one he “loves”, and his seemingly more powerful boss. People will see this internal struggle and will feel for him.
I see your point. A good one too I might add. I am trying to see how each plot would advance if Violet was the unwilling one and if Kid was the unwilling one.
I’ll admit, hypnotism seems pretty cheap to me. Why the heck did I suggest it in the first place? Anyways, I like the idea of blackmailing, but even with her husband near death, I doubt Helen would hurt her daughter. Same with Violet not hurting Helen.
I see her doing that same thing in a real crime fight as well as training.
Wow…three days gone and so much developed. Looks like the way we have headed with the villian is a two-some. One main villian that could possibly be used as the ultimate fighter and a minor villian that could be used in the life of Vi.
I would like an update on all “new” developements like “kid”…that way i can add them to my already over-stuffed brain. I thought about a “end of the world” scenario but what i really like is this;
What would happen if one man had the power to stop the rotation of the earth in 1 second? What would the results look like.?
I think the idea of stoping the rotation of the earth is clever, but if that does happen, we might be heading into too much into a sci-fi movie.